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Have standards really been lowered?

Glen Cook

G A Cook
Site Benefactor
I just think all brothers need to remember that it's the internal and not the external. Also freemasonry should never be on the same pedestal as a country club. Our fraternity is based on diversity and equality.
Is it? If so, this is a relatively recent view. The abundant racism into the late 20th C is evident not only from justifications given by Claudy, but the refusal, still extant, to recognize Prince Hall. There are Scandinavian GLs which admit only Christians. Multiple appendant bodies admit only Christians. Until 1984, the GLs of the United Stares condoned the prohibition of Latter-day Saints (Mormons) in membership in the GL of Utah.
 

JMartinez

Registered User
Is it? If so, this is a relatively recent view. The abundant racism into the late 20th C is evident not only from justifications given by Claudy, but the refusal, still extant, to recognize Prince Hall. There are Scandinavian GLs which admit only Christians. Multiple appendant bodies admit only Christians. Until 1984, the GLs of the United Stares condoned the prohibition of Latter-day Saints (Mormons) in membership in the GL of Utah.
But is that Masonic?
 

coachn

Coach John S. Nagy
Premium Member
...How has Freemasonry been “dumbed down”?
  1. By accepting Quantity as a method to cover costs.
  2. By advancing ill prepare Members.
  3. By restricting education to Organizational ends and not toward actual cultivation of the members toward Personal Mastery.
...When did this “dumbing down” begin?
  1. ~1717
...How have we lowered standards?
  1. By accepting Quantity as a method to cover costs.
  2. By advancing ill prepare Members.
  3. By restricting education to Organizational ends and not toward actual cultivation of the members toward Personal Mastery.
...How are candidates different now than in the past?
  1. Younger
  2. More immature
  3. More dependent
  4. Less well-read
  5. More misinformed
...How do you define “quality” as it relates to a petitioner?
  1. By reviewing his past improvement efforts and successes
  2. By assessing his continued desire to improve and his plans to do so.
  3. By ascertaining his vision for the future.
...I will agree that in terms of inflation adjusted dollars our dues are lower now than in the past.

As much as I agree that dues have not kept up with inflation when compared to what was paid in years past, I must say that, from all available information, the expense of running a lodge has dramatically lessened when adjusted for inflation.
 

coachn

Coach John S. Nagy
Premium Member
I agree that from what I have read, early members of Masonic Lodges were better/more broadly educated than members today and that it is not a recent (coinciding with the decline in membership) phenomenom.
Yup. Furthermore, the standardizing of Freemasonry into an assembly line driven advancement society based upon memorization and regurgitation of misunderstood scripts does nothing more than produce non-freethinking plug-n-play performers who produce more of the same.
 

hanzosbm

Premium Member
Yup. Furthermore, the standardizing of Freemasonry into an assembly line driven advancement society based upon memorization and regurgitation of misunderstood scripts does nothing more than produce non-freethinking plug-n-play performers who produce more of the same.
I agree with you completely. That being said, that might not be such a bad thing. Without the 'non-freethinking plug-n-play performers' we wouldn't have the numbers we have. And while I am certainly no proponent of quantity over quality, without those numbers we'd be hard pressed to find the quality brothers we're looking for.
Putting a pamphlet on the windshield of every car in a parking lot to come to a job interview might result in the average applicant being less suitable, but you get a much larger pool from which to find the perfect fit.
 

coachn

Coach John S. Nagy
Premium Member
I agree with you completely. That being said, that might not be such a bad thing. Without the 'non-freethinking plug-n-play performers' we wouldn't have the numbers we have. And while I am certainly no proponent of quantity over quality, without those numbers we'd be hard pressed to find the quality brothers we're looking for.
Putting a pamphlet on the windshield of every car in a parking lot to come to a job interview might result in the average applicant being less suitable, but you get a much larger pool from which to find the perfect fit.
Yup. But the question was about dumbing down and not about the benefits of dumbing down, hence the furthermore. The problem that such dumbed down numbers brings thus becomes, "perfect fit for what?"
 

Browncoat

Registered User
  1. Younger
  2. More immature
  3. More dependent
  4. Less well-read
  5. More misinformed

It's clear the Freemasonry has a problem at the local lodge level. While some lodges enjoy great success and its members fulfilled, the vast majority seem to be chock full of bored Masons who:
  • Often barely field enough officers to open the lodge
  • Have 10-20% attendance
  • Go through the motions and offer little else
In short, the previous generation has not so much "made good men better" through Freemasonry. They have created the current state of affairs, and now it is left up to the new generation of Masons who are essentially young and dumb to fix things. Meanwhile, the old guard are often the ones standing in the way of progress being made. "In my day" and "when I was in the East" are the rallying cries of these men who don't want their lodges changed.

What is your proposed solution, Coach N?
 

coachn

Coach John S. Nagy
Premium Member
...What is your proposed solution, Coach N?

To propose a solution would mean that there is a perceived problem. I do not see that there is a problem. Organizational Freemasonry is designed to do exactly what it does and the results you see are what it does by design. It shall continue to do exactly what it does into the future until it runs its course OR redesigns what it does to get different results. One cannot expect the results to change until it changes what it does.
 

Browncoat

Registered User
To propose a solution would mean that there is a perceived problem. I do not see that there is a problem. Organizational Freemasonry is designed to do exactly what it does and the results you see are what it does by design. It shall continue to do exactly what it does into the future until it runs its course OR redesigns what it does to get different results. One cannot expect the results to change until it changes what it does.
Going out on a limb here, Coach...you've coined a term there, so I'll do my best to interpret:

Organizational Freemasonry - Boring people to death in Blue Lodge, whose sole purpose is to serve as a feeder for appendant bodies. Those bodies are where Masons actually "learn" about Freemasonry, while at the same time, paying more dues.
 

LAMason

Premium Member
In short, the previous generation has not so much "made good men better" through Freemasonry. They have created the current state of affairs,
I am not sure the length of time you consider a generation to be, but based on the generally accepted time frame of about 25 years (http://www.ancestry.com/cs/Satellit...lt&pagename=LearningWrapper&cid=1265124426382) the problems you describe have existed much longer than one generation.

“There are few more vexatious problems which the Worshipful Master has to meet than that of increasing the attendance in a Lodge in which the members have, to some extent at least, lost interest.

It is a fact no less true than sad, that, on the average, an attendance of ten per cent of the membership is looked upon as a “Good” turnout. Yet there are Lodges which have a greater number at almost every communication.”

Increasing Lodge Attendance

by unknown

SHORT TALK BULLETIN - Vol.VI October, 1928 No.10
 

coachn

Coach John S. Nagy
Premium Member
Going out on a limb here, Coach...you've coined a term there, so I'll do my best to interpret:

Organizational Freemasonry - Boring people to death in Blue Lodge, whose sole purpose is to serve as a feeder for appendant bodies. Those bodies are where Masons actually "learn" about Freemasonry, while at the same time, paying more dues.
LOL! Yes, but with one slight augmentation: Members learn more about "Organizational Freemasonry", and are asked to 1) remain Moral, 2) remain silent about what goes on at that level and 3) support the level they are currently and all the previous levels.

Some come and go, and some stay. As I had posted: It is perfectly designed to get the results it gets.

BTW - O.F. is at its core theater; and more specifically a total emersion live action role playing Society designed to put on Morality Plays called "Degrees", all designed to bring paying patrons through total emersion performances for fee and to have those patrons continue to pay fees should they wish to see these performances again or participate within them. In the Blue Lodge theatric arena, the theme is based upon symbolic stone-craft. In higher Degrees, other themes are introduced supposedly complementary to this beginning theme. It's all theater though and this often times is not realized by the more zealous members who get swept away in the fantasy.
 

LAMason

Premium Member
current members are either A) not attending lodge and could care less about finding new members, or B) an active member, but unhappy/bored with their lodge experience and don't want to drag anyone else into it.

I posit that there is at least one other option C)members who are for the most part satisfied with their Lodge experience and are very willing for their friends and family members to join (i.e. I see 2B1ASK1 bumper stickers all the time and multi generational members are quite common. I know one man, a PM who has 2 sons, both are also PMs, and 2 grandsons who are Mason. They are all members of the same Lodge.). The attitudes/opinions of members could also likely be viewed as a continuum.
 
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Browncoat

Registered User
LOL! Yes, but with one slight augmentation: Members learn more about "Organizational Freemasonry", and are asked to 1) remain Moral, 2) remain silent about what goes on at that level and 3) support the level they are currently and all the previous levels.

I saw this Organizational Freemasonry first-hand last week:

1) My lodge traveled to another lodge (after a short open/close) for a visitation. This was my first time visiting another lodge, and I was stoked. We showed up with around 14 guys, and even though they had known for several months that we would be visiting on this date, they still had to make phone calls to get enough of their own members to come and fill chairs. A lot of those guys were sporting Scottish Rite rings and pins.

2) My father-in-law invited me to High Twelve last Friday. I saw a few familiar faces, but several new. This group supports two local lodges for the most part, and there was probably about 20 men present. Some of these guys were members of my own lodge, but I'd never seen them before.

3) The big talk last week that I overheard was the official closing of my county's Shriners group. I guess you need a certain amount of people present to even shut the thing down, and they were having problems even getting that part done. It's kind of sad, considering these guys have a van and transport several children in the area to Shriners hospitals...but now that's being shut down also due to lack of drivers.

Thanks for opening my eyes to this...guess I'd never really saw it that way. But now that I think about it, most of the older Masons that I know have done it all, so to speak. York Rite, Scottish Rite, Shriners, High Twelve, etc. My father-in-law held offices in all of those. I've had a few guys ask me about joining one thing or the other, but I haven't felt pressured by it.
 

pointwithinacircle2

Rapscallion
Premium Member
it is left up to the new generation of Masons who are essentially young and dumb to fix things.
Perhaps this quote can offer a new perspective, "The purpose of ritual is to allow those who do not understand the truth to pass the truth on until it reaches someone who can understand it". Perhaps the Masonic use of the word Equality is not intended to mean that we are all exactly alike. Maybe it only means that we are all given an equal shot at deciphering the truth. I agree that it is left to the young and dumb to fix things. They are to young to be jaded and cynical, and too dumb to believe that there are no hidden meanings and truths.

You don't have to read many of my posts to know that I always encourage Masons to learn something about Masonry and then to stand up in Lodge and talk about it. I am talking to the Brothers who are still young and dumb enough to believe that what they do matters. In my experience understanding is not a gift that only special people have, it is a nut that some Masons crack and some don't.
 

Browncoat

Registered User
Clearly Organizational Freemasonry has worked for previous generation(s). But it should also be clear that it is not going to work for the current or next generation. We're looking to squeeze the most out of our blue lodge experience, and if left unfulfilled there, we're certainly not going to go looking for it in appendant bodies. At least not in large numbers. Blue lodge shouldn't be viewed as a "stepping stone" into other things.
 
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