My Freemasonry | Freemason Information and Discussion Forum

Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

Just curious...

drmrboi927

Registered User
Before I got raised and not too long after, a Brother said you're going to see and hear things that you may not like but don't get discouraged or lose focus.
My question for you all is what have you seen or experienced that may have made you "uncomfortable" or almost "lose focus"?


Sent from my iPhone using My Freemasonry Pro
 

dfreybur

Premium Member
Before I got raised and not too long after, a Brother said you're going to see and hear things that you may not like but don't get discouraged or lose focus.
My question for you all is what have you seen or experienced that may have made you "uncomfortable" or almost "lose focus"?

Sounds to me like the Brother telling you that was enough of a fundie that he wonders why he's among us. Very much his issue not yours.

That or he meant that some of the Brothers take our rules against talking religion or politics in our "meetings" as only applying to tiled meetings so you'll hear inappropriate comments at the meals.

One of the pieces of wisdom taught to me by Dad - "God gave us two ears and a noodle. One ear for in, one ear for out. The noodle is to decide what sticks in the middle."

Some portion of the stuff I hear at lodge meals I let it flow in one ear and out the other.
 

Jason A. Mitchell

Premium Member
Before I got raised and not too long after, a Brother said you're going to see and hear things that you may not like but don't get discouraged or lose focus.
My question for you all is what have you seen or experienced that may have made you "uncomfortable" or almost "lose focus"?


Sent from my iPhone using My Freemasonry Pro

In no particular order

  • Masons believing Mackey
  • Masons not believing Gould, Carr, and Knoop
  • Masons mistaking legends and myths as Fact, or put more simply Masons not believing Jay Kinney
  • Masons putting all the right books on their shelves, but not putting all the right books in their heads
  • Masons misconstruing education and esoteric with occult sciences
  • Masons monetizing the Craft for personal benefit
  • Masons blogging purely for Masonic fame and recognition
 

Jason A. Mitchell

Premium Member
Of all the people u mentioned Mackey is the only person ive ever heard of

Sent from my LG-H811 using My Freemasonry Pro mobile app

Oh man, you're missing the good stuff.

In the US alone we've got the talents of Bullock, B. Jones, Kendall, Vaughan, J.F. Newton, MacNulty, Coil, de Hoyos, Morris, Davis, Kinney, Normand, and Hutchins and yet every gives all the love to Mackey.

And then, once you leave the US you get Knoop, Jones, Gould, Hammer, Carr, Mollier, ACF Jackson, Churton, Stevenson, Hamill, and more...

Mackey is good, so you know what everyone in the US took as truth, when it was anything but.
 

Jason A. Mitchell

Premium Member
If only we had a Masonic Science we would be able to move beyond belief and disbelief.

Nice play on words, but whereas Masonry is a system of morality, that is to say, Masonry deals in the realms immeasurable by science and indeed science won't measure belief and disbelief are essential to our art.
 
R

Ressam

Guest
"The definition of Freemasonry that it is "a science of morality, veiled in allegory, and illustrated by symbols,"
has been so often quoted, that, were it not for its beauty, it would become wearisome. But this definition
contains the exact principle that has just been enunciated. Freemasonry is a science..."

The Symbolism of Freemasonry, by Albert G. Mackey page 4.

These days it is all too hard for Grand Lodges, what with the loss of the genuine secrets.
Greetings, Mr.James!
It's a lil bit strange, IMHO, that you're confusing the definition.
It's written: "Science of morality". Morality. Morality is related with -- good/evil, human behavior, spirituality, etc. Shortly -- soul. We are not -- "Robots", Mr.James! The word "science" is wrong word to define Freemasonry, IMHO! Do you mean that Freemasonry is "Natural" Science? Definitely -- no. It's wrong. "Social" Science? Maybe. But, that means that: if it's social, it's kinda "theory". It may be "false". Without strict "proofs". Can Freemasonry "be wrong"?
 

Jason A. Mitchell

Premium Member
"The definition of Freemasonry that it is "a science of morality, veiled in allegory, and illustrated by symbols,"
has been so often quoted, that, were it not for its beauty, it would become wearisome. But this definition
contains the exact principle that has just been enunciated. Freemasonry is a science..."

The Symbolism of Freemasonry, by Albert G. Mackey page 4.

These days it is all too hard for Grand Lodges, what with the loss of the genuine secrets.

Well... Mackay is inadmissible here for two reasons. First, it's Mackey, and while he is well known, he's not a well of masonic knowledge. Mackey was a compiler of biases and masonic folk beliefs, not a cataloger of facts (though to give he credit he did manage to do quite a bit by accident). Second, Mackey isn't ritual. I'm taking a guess you're a mainstream American Mason, meaning you practice Webb Ritual (standard PA disclaimers apply), and Webb ritual is pretty consistent in its definition of Masonry - as system of morality veiled in allegory and illustrated by symbols. Our ritual doesn't say science.

But let's assume it does and use your QBL example. The Jewish Kabbalah and the Christian Cabbala are systems and models of esoteric biblical interpretation. The Hermetic Qabbalah which is what I think you're referring to is a mystical and theurgical and theosophical tool for inquiry, which can be likened to a science, but as we know from our ritual, science doesn't enter into it.

But anyway, this all stems from your comment that science would dispell belief and disbelief, as applied to Masonry. Using the example of the QBL, it is predicated upon belief, so it isn't a science that settles it the divide you highlighted, and as you assert.
 

dfreybur

Premium Member
The only real way to "alter concience" is to admi ister drugs

Prayer, mediation, education, contemplation all work well for me. As does NLP.

And for that matter deciding to fall asleep or wake up. I've never quite gotten how it works to decide to wake up but I do that frequently. Some sort of twilight dozing state where I am half aware half asleep.
 
Top