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Being Denied Membership at a Church

frehm

frehm

Registered User
Elexir said:
Actully the nordic bishops are sort of open to the Swedish rite just becuse of the fact we are christian only. Of course they wouldnt admit it openly but they dont have a problem with us.
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How do you know this? Well, OCD Anders Arborelius seems to be a nice, non-judgmental person. But still... they might not have a problem with us, but I guess it still wouldn't be possible to be a member of the catholic church and still remain a freemason.
 
HoldenMonty

HoldenMonty

Registered User
Well some halfway good news. After I sent an e-mail to the pastor telling him that I will not be leaving Freemasonry in order to join their church and told him how Freemasonry doesn't have specific theology but is accepting of all faiths just like the U.S. military is and a few other points and asked if my wife would be able to still join the church since it's mainly her that wants to join the church so she is able to be a teacher with the kids. To me personally if you have accepted Christ and have faith in him then you are apart of the overall biblical meaning of the word Church as in the body of Christ and having membership at a specific building seems silly to me.
 
CLewey44

CLewey44

Registered User
HoldenMonty said:
Hello Brothers,

So there was something interesting happened last night and I'm wondering if it has happened to any of you. So my family and I attend a baptist church that we have really loved going to and will still continue to go to. But anyway we talked to the pastor last night about joining the church because we have been attending for almost a year now and feel right at home going there. So we were everything was going good and then he mentioned how he noticed my Masonic ring and said that I can't be a member of the church if I am a Mason because of the theology of Masonry with saying higher up in Masonry that they believe that every god is the same. But anyway with keeping brotherly love as a priority. I'm wondering if any other brothers have ran into a similar issue where they have wanted to join a church and told that they aren't allowed to join a specific church or organization because they are a member.
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I noticed he mentioned the theology of Masonry. That alone tells me he doesn't know about Freemasonry. He also said that 'high up' Masons believe all gods are equal. Again, makes no sense. I don't think XYZ's God is on the same level as my God but I do respect and accept others' religious beliefs completely. Somehow acceptance, tolerance etc has become intertwined with equal or the same. It's almost militant when one religion thinks so down on others that they don't even want you to be associated with people from other religions. I wouldn't want to go to that church anyways, you may have better luck else where.
 
jermy Bell

jermy Bell

Registered User
Rifleman1776 said:
"you have to be a mason in order to be a Shriner"
No longer universally true. One can be a Shriner in Arkansas without being a MM. I understand other states are considering making the change also.
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That may be. But it' getting where no one wants anything to do with Arkansas. Or so I keep reading.
 
Bill Lins

Bill Lins

Moderating Staff
Staff Member
Rifleman1776 said:
"you have to be a mason in order to be a Shriner"
No longer universally true. One can be a Shriner in Arkansas without being a MM. I understand other states are considering making the change also.
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Also could be to get out from under the thumb of a Grand Lodge.
 
goomba

goomba

Neo-Antient
Site Benefactor
I had a pastor, while not nearly on the level of yours, was confused about the Craft. Luckily for me I studied Biblical and Theological studies at a major Baptist university and was able to convince him there was nothing wrong with Freemasonry. With that being said I will not go out of my way to convince anyone that we are good if they are closed minded. That we are nothing but a force of good in the world is obvious to anyone with common sense. I believe the EA charge when it says "neither are you to suffer your zeal for the institution to lead you into arguments with those who, through ignorance, may ridicule it."
 
MarkR

MarkR

Premium Member
Thomas Stright said:
I'm guessing to bring in more members?
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No, to replace the Masons who have been told by the Grand Lodge of Arkansas that they cannot continue their membership in the Shrine. Some have tried to demit to lodges in surrounding states so they can continue being both Masons and Shriners, but Arkansas will not give them letters of good standing. It's a serious mess.
 
coachn

coachn

Coach John S. Nagy
Premium Member
MarkR said:
No, to replace the Masons who have been told by the Grand Lodge of Arkansas that they cannot continue their membership in the Shrine. Some have tried to demit to lodges in surrounding states so they can continue being both Masons and Shriners, but Arkansas will not give them letters of good standing. It's a serious mess.
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:(
 
HoldenMonty

HoldenMonty

Registered User
Thank you brothers, I asked the same question to other brothers at the Lodge I go to at our practice last night and they all had similar ideas of you brothers and mentioned a few brothers that demited in order to become members of a church in the community. It also reminds me of part of the 1st degree charge in PA where it says He is not to neglect his own necessary avocations for the sake of Freemasonry, or to involve himself in quarrels with those who through ignorance may speak evilly or despitefully of it. So to me that is saying don't waste your breath trying to argue with those closed minded people about Freemasonry.
 
dfreybur

dfreybur

Premium Member
CLewey44 said:
Somehow acceptance, tolerance etc has become intertwined with equal or the same.
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Tolerance is not acceptance of the other's opinions or beliefs. Tolerance is accepting the other as a person.
Tolerance is not agreeing with the other. Tolerance is working together for common causes.
And so on down a long line of potential descriptions.

Immature folks confuse tolerance the way immature folks confuse forgiveness. Forgiveness is not forgetness.

On AR not issuing statements of good standing - Send a letter of resignation, disavow and go through your degrees in the other state. I get that it's not the fault of the lodges but rather of the jurisdiction. My response to such a jurisdiction would be a rude gesture. They don't get to stop me from leaving.
 
goomba

goomba

Neo-Antient
Site Benefactor
dfreybur said:
Tolerance is not acceptance of the other's opinions or beliefs. Tolerance is accepting the other as a person.
Tolerance is not agreeing with the other. Tolerance is working together for common causes.
And so on down a long line of potential descriptions.

Immature folks confuse tolerance the way immature folks confuse forgiveness. Forgiveness is not forgetness.

On AR not issuing statements of good standing - Send a letter of resignation, disavow and go through your degrees in the other state. I get that it's not the fault of the lodges but rather of the jurisdiction. My response to such a jurisdiction would be a rude gesture. They don't get to stop me from leaving.
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The other grand lodges should step up and help correct this problem. Issuing an edict saying they will accept a Mason's word they wish to demit from Arkansas. We shouldn't stand by as Freemasons are held captive.

Sent from my XT1650 using Tapatalk
 
coachn

coachn

Coach John S. Nagy
Premium Member
dfreybur said:
Tolerance is not acceptance of the other's opinions or beliefs. Tolerance is accepting the other as a person.
Tolerance is not agreeing with the other. Tolerance is working together for common causes.
And so on down a long line of potential descriptions....
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Tolerance is not responding or reacting "negatively or violently" toward any perceived source of irritation or discomfort.

Tolerance is responding and reacting "positively and non-violently" toward any perceived source of irritation or discomfort.
 
Warrior1256

Warrior1256

Site Benefactor
dfreybur said:
Tolerance is not acceptance of the other's opinions or beliefs. Tolerance is accepting the other as a person.
Tolerance is not agreeing with the other. Tolerance is working together for common causes.
And so on down a long line of potential descriptions.
Click to expand...
coachn said:
Tolerance is not responding or reacting "negatively or violently" toward any perceived source of irritation or discomfort.

Tolerance is responding and reacting "positively and non-violently" toward any perceived source of irritation or discomfort.
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I agree with all the above.
 
Rifleman1776

Rifleman1776

Registered User
Bill Lins said:
Also could be to get out from under the thumb of a Grand Lodge.
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Jeremy, Thomas and Bill
The change came from the split in Arkansas between Grand Lodge and Shrine. Long, sad story with many versions. I demited out of the Arkansas lodge where I was raised and joined a lodge in Missouri (only about 30 miles away). Many other Arkansas MMs have fled the state to lodges in surrounding states. The animus between Grand Lodge and Shrine was so serious this change had to be made so Shriners could remain MMs and to bring in new members to the Shrine. This is a very condensed version of the entire mess. BTW, I read here that Oklahoma Grand Lodge has withdrawn recognition of Arkansas masonry.
 
Glen Cook

Glen Cook

G A Cook
Site Benefactor
Rifleman1776 said:
Jeremy, Thomas and Bill
The change came from the split in Arkansas between Grand Lodge and Shrine. Long, sad story with many versions. I demited out of the Arkansas lodge where I was raised and joined a lodge in Missouri (only about 30 miles away). Many other Arkansas MMs have fled the state to lodges in surrounding states. The animus between Grand Lodge and Shrine was so serious this change had to be made so Shriners could remain MMs and to bring in new members to the Shrine. This is a very condensed version of the entire mess. BTW, I read here that Oklahoma Grand Lodge has withdrawn recognition of Arkansas masonry.
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The instant action has nothing to do with the shrine.

The Oklahoma decision was reversed.

We are informed the KS decision is largely based on the original OK reasoning, with a note of refusing to admit KS visitors because they are in Amity with PHA.
 
okielabrat

okielabrat

Registered User
Sad to hear about that. At our church (a Southern Baptist one, I may add), we have seven men who are Masons, and two of them are deacons. One is an usher, while two more play in our church's Music Ministry team. Plus, we have several OES ladies (including the Worthy Matron of our local Chapter). I have never heard anything discouraging from our pastor or other members of the congregation.

I took a moment to peruse some of the websites and YouTube videos that disparage our fraternity, and I'm not sure whether to laugh or just shake my head in disbelief. The one about taking over the world is a hoot- we can't even decide half the time on what to serve at high twelve time, much less plot world domination;) (and no, I don't believe a word of the drivel I read. If I want to see what Masonry is all about, I can look no farther than my Lodge brethren and those brethren of the Lodges I have been privileged to attend (including the one who conducted my raising ceremony).

I sincerely hope and pray you will find a church you are made to feel comfortable in, and that you will not turn away from Christianity due to the opinion of one misguided person.
 
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