Having many masters?

Discussion in 'Masonic Jurisprudence' started by Mac, Jul 19, 2011.

  1. Mac

    Mac Moderator Premium Member

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    Brothers, we travel more than our ancestors did, and with the advent of ideas like Internet Lodge under the UGLE, it's possible to be a member of several Grand Lodges.

    If you are a member of a Grand Lodge (call this GLX) that fully recognizes PHA Masonry (visitation, everything), but also a member of a Grand Lodge that does not allow visitation (example: Texas)... Can you sit in Lodge with PHA brethren if you're in the state of GLX? What about visiting one in Texas?
     
  2. JJones

    JJones Moderator Staff Member

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    I thought Grand Lodge recognized PHA Masonry a few years back and it was acceptable to visit them?
     
  3. Mac

    Mac Moderator Premium Member

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    I asked at a Wardens Retreat a year or so ago what the status of our relations was, since I'm a new Mason. The answer I received was that we recognize each other as valid institutions of Freemasonry, but we cannot hold Masonic communication.
     
  4. Beathard

    Beathard Premium Member

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    In Texas we have recognized each other since 2006, but do not allow communication or visitation. The rule on visitation does not depend on which GL you belong to, it depends on which one you are in. For example: Texas does not allow visitation. Kansas does. If a Texas mason is in Kansas and goes to a lodge recognized by Texas and there is a Prince Hall Mason in that lodge, the Texas mason can have fraternal relations with that Prince Hall mason. Why? Because Kansas allows it.
     
  5. Mac

    Mac Moderator Premium Member

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    Thank you for the prompt and concise answer.

    But boy does my head hurt.
     
  6. LukeD

    LukeD Registered User

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    I've heard so many different answers to this question, it does cause ones head to hurt. I wish something more concrete would come out concerning the issue when it comes to visitation if someone is a member under two different GLs. So, say you belong to a lodge in TX and KS. What are the rules concerning visiting a PH lodge recognized by GLoKS, but not the GLoTX? I understand the previous answer of a PH brother meeting in a lodge in KS recognized by TX, but does it change when visiting a PH lodge? It seems very confusing when plural membership comes into the equation.
     
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2011
  7. Mac

    Mac Moderator Premium Member

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    Can we complicate this by asking about what happens if a Widow's Son presents a paper on behalf of the Philalethes Society in a Lodge you're visiting? :laugh:

    In all seriousness: if I were to join a different Grand Lodge, one that doesn't have a ban on the Philalethes Society, could I then join that research society?
     
  8. Benton

    Benton Premium Member

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    I think, technically, it would depend upon which jurisdiction you currently reside in. But I could be wrong.
     
  9. chancerobinson

    chancerobinson Registered User

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    Maybe I should ask this as a separate topic, but are Texas Masons banned from joining Philalethes, or does the ban only apply to official meetings in this state sponsored by Philalethes?
     
  10. Bill Lins

    Bill Lins Moderating Staff Staff Member

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    As I understand it, a GLoT Mason may subscribe to the Philalethes magazine & website, but may NOT "join" the Philalethes Society.
     
  11. Mac

    Mac Moderator Premium Member

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    What if he's also a member of a Lodge in another jurisdiction? Could someone join Internet Lodge and become a UGLE Mason, thereby allowing him to join the Philalethes Society?
     
  12. MikeMay

    MikeMay Premium Member

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    The key in your question is "also"...if a Master Mason is under the GLoT and the GLoT says no (as it has, for example, with the Widow's Sons)...that's it. For Texas Masons under the GLoT, the obligation is clear on that...

    If a Master is under another Grand Lodge and that Grand Lodge says it's okay then that Master Mason is free to join.
     
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2011
  13. Nate Riley

    Nate Riley Premium Member

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    My question is: When are you under the jurisdiction of a particular Grand Lodge? My take on it is that since I belong to a Lodge in Texas, I am under the jurisdiction of the Grand Lodge of Texas even if I am physically traveling to another state.

    If I move to another state (say Florida) and join a lodge there by affliation (or whatever the legal term is), but remain a member of my lodge in Texas, my guess is that I remain under the jurisdiction of the Grand Lodge of Texas (and also the Grand Lodge of Florida). So I have to abide by the rules of each.

    Tell me if I am right or wrong! I really don't know, but I like to go the conservative route when I comes to my obligations.
     
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2011
  14. Nate Riley

    Nate Riley Premium Member

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    Let me also express my opposition to the idea of joining an additional Grand Lodge to get around the rules of another.
     
  15. Brent Heilman

    Brent Heilman Premium Member

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    Yeah this all really confuses me. My brain now hurts trying to figure it all out.
     
  16. Benton

    Benton Premium Member

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    For some reason, I was under the impression that the Grand Lodge under whose jurisdiction you reside is the Grand Lodge jurisdiction which takes precedence, though when visiting an out of state lodge, you should respect and abide by their customs and law. I'm trying to find a factual reason to back up my inclination, but I'm coming up short. I might have just dreamed it.
     
  17. jwhoff

    jwhoff Premium Member

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    Thanks Brother Bill. That clears up a question I've had of late.
     
  18. Mac

    Mac Moderator Premium Member

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    Here's another hypothetical, then: If a Freemason from England moves to Texas, but retains his Lodge membership in England and also chooses to become a member of a Texas Lodge... England allows its Masons to join the Philalethes Society, while Texas does not. Would this brother suddenly find himself having to cancel his membership in the research group? What if he had a life membership?

    I appreciate everyone's responses. I think this conversation has made it quite clear how unclear our rights and privileges can be at times. ;)
     
  19. WarriorProphet

    WarriorProphet Registered User

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    The obligation states you will follow the rules and edicts of the grand lodge "under whose jurisdiction you may find yourself". The question, as our real estate brethren say, is of "location, location, location".
     
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2011
  20. Mac

    Mac Moderator Premium Member

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    Some times the simplest answer is the best answer. I guess I should have paid more attention. ;)
     

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