Knights of columbus?

Discussion in 'General Freemasonry Discussion' started by JMartinez, Feb 13, 2015.

  1. JMartinez

    JMartinez Registered User

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    Any brethren members of the KoC? Do the KoC let masons join? Do you get any hassle for being a mason? Can you still be excommunicated for being a mason? I hope I'm not the only catholic mason.
     
  2. MarkR

    MarkR Premium Member

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    You're definitely not the only Catholic Mason. I know plenty. I've known of men who were both KoC and Masons, but I don't know if their KoC knew about it. The last statement from Rome is that Catholics who are Masons are in a state of "grave sin" and should not receive communion, but American bishops have generally been "not noticing" Masons in their parishes.
     
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  3. Bill Lins

    Bill Lins Moderating Staff Staff Member

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    KCs in our area will not knowingly allow Masons to belong to their organization.
     
  4. JMartinez

    JMartinez Registered User

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    There must be brothers who are both.
     
  5. Morris

    Morris Premium Member

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    See bro mark's post.
     
  6. JMartinez

    JMartinez Registered User

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    I was hoping for responses from brethren who are both, and can offer light
     
  7. JMartinez

    JMartinez Registered User

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    I guess my question should be, do catholic masons feel "singled out"?
     
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  8. JMartinez

    JMartinez Registered User

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    As a Catholic Mason, I constantly find myself looking for the definitive answer from the Church regarding Masonry, and realize either they're out of date, unspoken of, or still welcomed depending on who you ask.
    However, my question is not in regards to that, but rather joining the Catholic fraternity Knights of Columbus. I would love to be more involved with my faith and feel this would be an excellent way, however I am not familiar with whether or not they expressly forbid Masons into the group. I know some plural Mason/Knights exist, but whether they did not disclose their membership or did and were still accepted, I'm not sure.
    Before I walk over to the KoC sub reddit and ask, I was wondering if anyone here was a member, or possibly knew the answer on being allowed in.
    I certainly don't want to hold back my Masonic ties as I'm very proud of them, but I withhold my Mason affiliations from the Church at-large for obvious, centuries old and out of date reasons and don't want to start a potential nightmare by a simple question.
     
  9. dfreybur

    dfreybur Premium Member

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    It depends on local clergy so there is no general answer. And it's not just that the answer varies by parish. It varies by which priest happens to be in charge at the parish. Different place, might be different answer. Different time, might be different answer.

    I know brother Masons who are in the KofC in suburban Chicago without a blink. I know brother Masons who are int he KofC in suburban Los Angeles who were encouraged but not required to resign from Masonry. But we could look again a decade later and in either case the answer might change.
     
  10. Flatworlder

    Flatworlder Registered User

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    I do know of a story of a fellow brother taking classes to be baptized as Catholic only to be turned away during the beginning of the class. During the registration for this class my fellow brother wore his masonic ring, and the receptionist noticed it. She had kept quiet and wrote to the Archdioceses and put in a request to cut him from this class or any other future class.
    Im still at a loss for why the animosity towards our fraternity?
    Might I add I was brought up as a Catholic.. And I have found that I am more at home within my Lodge than at the closed cliques of the local church.. Which I am happy to say is fine with me.
     
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2015
  11. pointwithinacircle2

    pointwithinacircle2 Rapscallion Premium Member

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    Fundamentalism is the belief that any idea that is different from mine is evil.
     
  12. JMartinez

    JMartinez Registered User

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    Brethren, I have contacted the Knights of Columbus via their web site, this is their response:
    A potential applicant or current member’s membership in a social group such as the Elks does not automatically disqualify their membership in the Knights of Columbus. However, since questions such as this may deal with a person’s Catholicity and standing in the Roman Catholic Church, it is advised that you consult with your parish priest for his opinion.
    In regard to a potential applicant or current member who is associated with the Masons, there is often confusion as to whether or not he qualifies for membership. As a result, our legal department has issued the following response concerning this matter:

    The question here is NOT whether one can be a Knight of Columbus and a Mason. The question is whether one can be a Catholic in union with the Holy See and at the same time be enrolled in a Masonic Association. The question of whether or not a member or candidate for membership is a Catholic in union with the Holy See is a pastoral question that is properly directed to local chaplains, pastors, and bishops. Candidates for membership in the Knights of Columbus known to be members of Masonic Associations should be presented with copies of the Church's teaching and must resign their membership in such Masonic Associations before being admitted to membership in the Knights of Columbus.

    The fact is that many Catholics are unaware of the Church's constant teaching prohibiting a Catholic's enrollment in a Masonic Association. When a Catholic has a question regarding his or another's enrollment in a Masonic Association, the first thing to determine is whether that person is in fact enrolled in a Masonic Association. This determination should be made through a private and confidential conversation with the person in question. This conversation should be non-argumentative and non-confrontational. The purpose of the meeting is simply to confirm whether the member is enrolled in a Masonic Association and to determine whether the member is aware of the Church's teaching. When addressing the Church's teaching during this conversation, the first point of reference should be hard copies of the Church's most recent definitive statements on the issue. Please find attached copies of these statements which are as follows:

    (1) DECLARATION ON MASONIC ASSOCIATIONS, issued by the CONGREGATION FOR THE DOCTRINE OF THE FAITH in 1983
    (available at http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/c...aith_doc_19831126_declaration-masonic_en.html ); and

    (2) "Irreconcilability between Christian faith and Freemasonry," an article in L'Osservatore Romano dated March 11, 1985
    (available at http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/c...19850223_declaration-masonic_articolo_en.html)
    Prayerful study of these two statements should be encouraged, as they provide Catholics with solid guidance on how to "think with the Church" when considering a Catholic's enrollment in a Masonic Association. A Catholic being presented with these statements must be given adequate time to prayerfully consider the Church's teaching and to seek spiritual direction from his pastor in the context of his personal faith formation. If, after full fraternal and pastoral counseling and the passage of a reasonable period of time in which to prayerfully consider the Church's teaching, a member of the Knights of Columbus declines to resign from the Knights of Columbus or the Masonic Association, then the matter shall be referred to the State Deputy for final resolution. After consulting with the State Chaplain, the State Deputy may take appropriate action, up to and including summary suspension of the member.
     
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  13. Morris

    Morris Premium Member

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    Q: am I living in sin being a mason?
    A: let me check with the legal department

    Sorry, first thoughts when I read legal department. Haha
     
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  14. pointwithinacircle2

    pointwithinacircle2 Rapscallion Premium Member

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    So as long as I don't "think for myself" I should be golden.
     
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  15. JamestheJust

    JamestheJust Registered User

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    As a Roman Catholic I was taught that the last court of appeal is my own conscience. Hence, when the practices of the Church do not seem correct, while waiting for change, I do what seems right for me.

    Of course the priests also pointed out that I have an obligation to form my conscience correctly - without actually saying how that should be done.

    So I do what seems right and don't talk too much about matters on which others might differ.
     
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  16. LRG

    LRG Premium Member

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    I am currently both. I got active with a church again, being raised catholic. I was asked to resign from the lodge and show proof. ;)
    I went through all 4 degrees, nothing hit home what so ever. I would've fulfilled my wanting by joining the alter boy service again. The meetings were pretty much dinner with segregation. Being a Master Mason and attending dinner with your brothers is like no other fraternal order or sometimes paternal. Ask yourself this, out of all that you have been apart of ,Masonic, have you ever been apart of evil? So where in flies pestering in cow patties does the holy Catholic Church get the right to claim that masonry is evil? To me the KoC was a huge waste of time and money and once again I'm catholic, but I have realized that believing and loving Jesus Christ does not come from being catholic, nor being a Mason. It comes from your faith being well founded:) your uprightness in conduct through those many stations in life. It is no ones business what you do or who you are. Not of religion my brother, but of faith. But of faith, which charitable organization helps so many children? Vs religion, which religious order does so much for our children? Also, the koc is all about selling you and your family life insurance. Hope this helps
     
  17. LRG

    LRG Premium Member

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    They are then at fault. No one has the right to deny those seeking in our Lord Jesus Christ
     
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  18. Texan92

    Texan92 Registered User

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    This is what happens when one does not remember their history, or should I say swept it under the rug. Research why the Catholic Church has denounced Masons. What or whom had the influence and why, the answer may surprise you.
     
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  19. Flatworlder

    Flatworlder Registered User

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    I do know the History... and I am still reading more.. and the majority of this information does make me question certain things..Thats all I will say now, I don't want to stir up controversy.
     
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  20. Brother_Steve

    Brother_Steve Premium Member

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    The catholic church for all intents and purposes is a corporation. If you want to be a member of their club you need to play by their rules.
     
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