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Non-Christian in Commandery?

scialytic

Premium Member
I'm not sure why he would want to.


No. It is a strictly Christian Order, and uses the New Testament.


The Commandery wants Christian Masons to join. They want all Christian Masons to join. That is their motto, and I believe, their goal.

Thanks Brother. I guess the only reason for a non-Christian to join would be further Light and the history. I would imagine that there are plenty of non-Christians. I guess I'll just keep my mouth shut about things that I haven't experienced. I thought I was doing good...live-and-learn.

Thanks for being straight with the answers Brother.
 

jwhoff

Premium Member
No question is a bad question brother! The courage to ask what others dare not is commendable.

I solute you.
 

Brother JC

Moderating Staff
Staff Member
You didn't say anything wrong, Brother. Every Commandery, like every Lodge, will have it's own flavour and level of intensity. I know of Knights who have been challenged by one of the "old guard" for his definition of Christian. It all worked out, but it was tense. They were both well-respected leaders in the Commandery.
Each aspirant has to decide for himself if he wants to take the Orders. They are certainly beautiful, insightful rituals, especially when put on full form.
 

Bro. Stewart P.M.

Lead Moderator Emeritus
Staff Member
Being close minded and strictly for Christians are not related, you do realize this, don't you?

scialytic does not appear to me as attempting to making his statement into a personal attack against Christians. I do see how it may have been taken that way. What was clearly meant by the "KT" being "closed minded" is not a reference to mentality, but as to being open to all forms of religion.

Please don't get snippy with me. I'm just a messenger. As I said, I'm planning for this Light. This is a common mentality I've personally witnessed. I've advocated the Chapter and Council to non-Christians. My research has found that it brings the first three degrees full-circle. I'm not the one to convince. But before I am enlightened from experience, I can only share what I know to be true from Brothers (i.e. youz guyz!).

So, if the answer is no...fine. I just want to be able to dispell the shadows regarding the Commandery and being a non-Christian. Is it conducive for a non-Christian to join? If so, how? Can an obligation be taken on another VSL? If you know non-Christian Brothers in the Commandery, what is their take and justification that may not be common knowledge to non-Christian Brothers? Does the Commandery even really want non-Christians to join?

Feel free to PM me as this thread is clearly getting sensitive and some answers may not be best to just be posted. I can also give you my cell if you want to talk. Again, I am Christian and plan to go YR. This is not info for me to decide my future...I just want to share Light.

Here's the deal, the chivalric ordrers of Commandry requres one to take oaths pertaining to the protection & of Christianity. To me it would not make sense for any non-Christian to take such an obligation, unless they felt like they could in truth and body support such. The York Rite Bodies want all MASONS to be able to participate in their degrees & orders, and are in no position to turn anyone away based on religion. As to whether or not one should join the YR or better yet the KT is a personal decision that should be left to the individual.
 

scialytic

Premium Member
Sorry for getting pissy Brother Vick. I've still got much respect for you and what you do to spread Light to all. Peace and Harmony...
At least now I know what happens when you mess with Sir Knights... :11:
 

widows son

Premium Member
See as a non Christian, I would take the oath to defend it. Even though I don't believe Christ is my saviour, I still believe that Christianity is a treasure trove of morals and lesson to be learned, so I would defend that. I would also defend it because my it has influenced many brothers who I respect so in turn I would defend them and their belief. Would that qualify me to the KT?
 

jwhoff

Premium Member
Agreed! Everyone's faith is in jeopardy when only one's faith is in jeopardy.

However, this idea will not hold in the human nature court of law.

Zealots are like sirens ... to intoxicating to resist.

Division reigns supreme in the eyes of man.
 

KSigMason

Traveling Templar
Site Benefactor
See as a non Christian, I would take the oath to defend it. Even though I don't believe Christ is my saviour, I still believe that Christianity is a treasure trove of morals and lesson to be learned, so I would defend that. I would also defend it because my it has influenced many brothers who I respect so in turn I would defend them and their belief. Would that qualify me to the KT?
I've heard of stories of non-Christians taking the vow and keeping it, but the Constitutions are pretty straightforward:

Grand Encampmement Constitution:
Section 177 (b): Who is a firm believer in the Christian religion
Now the Encampment is only as powerful as the Grand Commanderies who ally and support it:

My Grand Commandery says the following:

Grand Commandery of Idaho Constitution:
Section 331 (d): The Petitioner shall declare that he is a firm believer in the Christian Religion and that he has read the petition and has personally signed the same.
Now I guess one may argue there is a difference between belief and practice or follower.
 

widows son

Premium Member
Does believer mean believing in what it stands for, or believing in the Christ? Does practice mean living out the teachings of Christ? Or praying, going to church and believing in Jesus? Does following mean accepting the truths in the moral and spiritual lessons of the Son or does it mean to be one who just follows?
 

Bro_Vick

Moderator
Premium Member
Another question is what if it is discovered that someone who is in the KT, isn't a devoted Christian?

Jurisdiction by jurisdiction, but it is the same as claiming a belief in deity when you don't have one as a Freemason.

S&F,
-Bro Vick
 
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