One Day Masonic Class/Journey

Discussion in 'Becoming a Freemason' started by Jasko Hodzic, Oct 11, 2014.

  1. Levelhead

    Levelhead Premium Member

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    I just dont want to see anyone get cheated out of the "Masonic" experience.

    I worked way too hard , studying, memorizing, giving back, waiting periods, ect to give someone who just walked in paid and got raised respect. Respect for what? Not having enough time?

    Thats laziness. Excuse to be made a MM and not do the work. We yell guys who come to our lodge "if you cant put in the time then masonry is not for you"

    And i will bet my bottom dollar guys who did a one day class can not proficiently even read the coded books to even follow along none the less sit in a chair.

    Its not Un Masonic to keep our roots of dedication and edict in our heart and in violet.

    Im an upright man and mason. I put in my time and sweat (literally) to keep the traditions the best i could as i went through.

    Im only talking about MASONRY (blue lodge) .

    We had a HIGH RANKING person join, get initiated and he was under the suspicion that since he had no time and was a high ranking person that we would need him and pass him through i guess a one day or under the radar. Great guy great person, ton of connections but masonry was not for him nor was he for our lodge.
     
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  2. Brother JC

    Brother JC Vigilant Staff Member

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    Levelhead, you've made your opinion quite clear already. Please reign your passions in and move on.
     
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  3. Levelhead

    Levelhead Premium Member

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    No problem!
     
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  4. Brother JC

    Brother JC Vigilant Staff Member

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  5. Pete Ramboldt

    Pete Ramboldt Registered User

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    I know of 5 MM's in our lodge that went through the ODC and all of them are proficient in their work! # of them have gone through the chairs and are Past Masters of the lodge and did a great job all of the way through. No mater how one attaines the degree of MM they deserve the respect of that achievement!
    I also am not too keen on the ODC, however masons in our lodge meet and act on the level.
    The fault of not knowing the work is on the lodge for not having calsses to teach after the degrees are over not on the candidate.
     
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  6. crono782

    crono782 Premium Member

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    I think it's great that there are Masons who turned out great despite their ODC. I much prefer that they end up good MMs than not. However I would not consider their turning out ok as justification to continue ODCs. I personally think they (one days) are by products of our instant gratification, "I want it now", convenience-centric societal mentality. Something earned and worked hard for is appreciated. More so something *sacrificed* for. An inconvenient schedule IMO does not qualify for a one day or on sight, but that's my opinion. Only something so dire as "this is the only opportunity in his life to do this" kinda exception. I feel they are contrary to the whole point... although I guess that depends on what you feel the point of Freemasonry actually is.

    I would not look down on, disrespect, or consider less an ODC'er. Rather I think I just feel sad that their experience was so truncated and lament that we have devolved into convenience over ritual.
     
  7. Glen Cook

    Glen Cook G A Cook Site Benefactor

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    So, in jurisdictions such as UGLE that don't require this lengthy memorization, the members aren't entitled to respect? Hmm
     
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  8. Glen Cook

    Glen Cook G A Cook Site Benefactor

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    and for lodges which don't have this ceremony as part of their ritual? Are our members not entitled to your respect?
     
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  9. Companion Joe

    Companion Joe Premium Member

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    While I doubt that I would look negatively on a person who did the ODC, I certainly don't have a positive opinion of getting your degrees in one day. It is contrary to the landmarks of the craft. You learn to become a Mason by working with someone to learn your lectures. I agree that ODCs are a byproduct of today's instant gratification, want it now mentality.

    To my knowledge, my state doesn't allow one day classes. In 20 years as a MM, I have never heard of it being done here. I know for a fact no one in my end of the state does it.
     
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  10. Glen Cook

    Glen Cook G A Cook Site Benefactor

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    Which Landmarks?
     
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  11. Companion Joe

    Companion Joe Premium Member

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    The landmark of the lectures being passed mouth to ear, it being a right of passage to learn your lectures and pass them, the time spent with a mentor teaching you your lectures. After 20 years, I remember very little about my actual degrees. I can remember one thing from my EA, absolutely nothing about my FC, and one thing from the first section and two from the second section of my MM. I couldn't tell you who conferred either of my first two degrees, but I can remember working with my mentor learning all three lectures as if it were yesterday. My mentor conferred my MM, and I do remember him choking up when he presented me with my apron.
     
  12. Glen Cook

    Glen Cook G A Cook Site Benefactor

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    I'm fairly familiar with the various lists of landmarks. I've never seen that one. Does TN still use the list of 15 Landmarks? Pretty sure that isn't in it. Indeed, my province of Cheshire, the oldest Masonic province, does not use mouth to ear. I doubt if we are in violation of a landmark, noting we've been around 50 years before the US was founded and about 88 years before the Grand Lodge of TN. I think we're pretty good on the "traditional" way.

    Further, a number of jurisdictions allow the Grand Master to waive the time for various reasons. Remember also, that the two degrees were originally conferred on one day. That would be the traditional way.

    If someone doesn't like the accelerated classes, that's fine, and I can see the reasoning behind developing a relationship with a mentor and time to reflect on the degree. But arguments as to landmarks and tradition are not helpful.
     
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  13. Companion Joe

    Companion Joe Premium Member

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    I didn't mean landmark as in Masonic Landmark. Perhaps I should have said "one of the foundations" of becoming a Mason. Sorry for any confusion. Our state allows the GM to waive the time and allows him to make Masons at sight if he wishes, but that isn't the point. In our state, the waiting time is 28 days, based on the lunar calendar when lodges met on the first night of the full moon instead of set nights.

    You don't use mouth to ear? Does that mean your lectures are written down?
     
  14. Glen Cook

    Glen Cook G A Cook Site Benefactor

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    So, a foundation of Masonry is ear to mouth instruction and waiting between degrees? I don't accept that either philosophically or factually.

    In UGLE not just the lectures are written, but the entire ritual (but for the G and PW). In Utah the lectures are written and candidates are provided a cipher for the other work. So, we know that the mode of learning is not a foundation of Freemasonry.

    In Utah, the waiting time between degrees is two weeks. Again, remember that the two degrees were conferred in Scotland at the same time. So, a particular waiting time isn't a foundation of Freemasonry.

    Therefore, it just doesn't appear that these are parts of the foundation of Masonry. And, how sad if that were to be the case: to say that we require no more than that asked of a 12 year old learning his verses.

    As to memorization, it might be useful to look at Paul Bessel's website as to the various forms that are now allowed: http://bessel.org/advance.htm. England has about 9-11 questions. It takes about three minutes to answer them. Consequently, extensive memorization of the catechism doesn't appear to be a foundation of Masonry either.

    In fact one might argue these are all innovations in Freemasonry <G>.

    Again, there are reasons to argue against an accelerated class, but declaring this item or that to be a foundation or landmark usually is not well laid. For instance, in Utah we have extensive proficiency requirements to be come Master: open and close in all three degrees; confer all three degrees including KS and the G lecture in the second. Should I declare that to be a foundation of Masonry and those who depart from it aren't good Masters?
     
  15. Companion Joe

    Companion Joe Premium Member

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    To each his own, as you and I have disagreed on many threads. But if everything is written down in plain language, and all that is required is to answer a few questions, Freemasonry might as well be no more than the Moose or the Elks.
     
  16. Zack

    Zack Registered User

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    I whole heartedly endorse this. I wish we had this rule. It is tedious, at best, to watch a Master struggle to open and close a lodge. It certainly doesn't speak well to "the right of advancement".
     
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  17. Glen Cook

    Glen Cook G A Cook Site Benefactor

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    Actually, I am a member of two other fraternal orders. My grandfather and great grandfather were Odd Fellows. I don't know that Masonry is better or worse than those are. It is older. FWIW, I did learn mouth to ear and am a Past Grand Lecturer in Utah and a Senior Ritualist. So, my view of the necessity of memorization isn't just sour grapes.

    It appears we really are in agreement here: objections to one day classes are a personal preference, and not based upon landmark, foundation or tradition.

    I only remember disagreeing on one issue, that of feminine masonry, and my expression of surprise that you had never heard of such until the internet discussion this year. That doesn't mean there should or would be disagreement on another issue. As you gain experience in wider Freemasonry (which I think is the stumbling block), you will find it common that disagreement on one issue is not necessarily an indicator of disagreement on others.
     
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  18. MasterBulldawg

    MasterBulldawg Registered User

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    I am a one day class Mason. I worked just as hard as you did. I stood proficient in ALL THREE Degrees. I have been active since being raised. I have gone through the chairs and put on degrees now a past master. I have meet many a Master Mason who does not like the one day class but that's do to the fact that many of them(1 day class masons) never learn the work. I missed out on nothing . Oh btw when I join the lodge that was how they did it then. In Florida each Grand Master decides if one day classes are allowed and none have since my year except for men in the Armed Services who meet certain requirements can do 1 day classes. So you Levelhead would not give them the same respect? IMHO anyone who is raised as a Master Mason and is willing to put in the work to be a good and fruitful Mason gets my respect.
     
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2014
  19. phulseapple

    phulseapple Premium Member

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    Personally I am opposed to the one day class for Blue Lodge, mainly because of how my lodge has been doing degrees. However, I can say that under certain circumstances, it could be appropriate. It would also depend on how the class is held. If each degree was conferred and time spent between each discussing the degree, and I mean ACTIVE discussion with the candidates, then it would sit better with me than if the degrees were simply presented in rapid succession with no time for the candidates to digest at least a few of the symbolic meanings. I have no problem with a MM who went through a one day class, provided he can prove he is worthy of that rank and title. If he cannot prove he is worthy, that indicates to me that he either did not receive proper instruction or needs more time to master his skills. Both of which can be corrected with the proper teacher. It is the mason (one day or not) that merely goes through the motions without the intent or desire to improve himself that is the detriment to our great fraternity. Remember, we must all continually use the working tools to transform our rough ashlar into the perfect ashlar.
     
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  20. kastonw

    kastonw Premium Member

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    Well said
     

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