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Problem. DDGM Lied

MO-AF&AM-3

Registered User
Brethren,

I am writing this post as I am somewhat new to the intricate workings of GL and BL functions in the way that I am about to describe below. So here it goes.

Last week my BL had our official GL visit with the newly installed DDGM. During his time as the Acting WM of the lodge he gave us his "vision" of freemasonry. He puffed his chest and told us that he was a "COP" and if we were caught stealing money he would send us to jail. Which is sort of how life goes and that not a problem with me. However I know quite a bit about the RWB and know that he is not a police officer and has never been a "COP" I however was a police officer in the military for 4 years and a police officer for 8 years, in the same major city he is trying to claim. Furthermore there was a lodge brother that was at the same meeting who I know is a 30 year retired police officer of the same department. There are other police officers that are members of my lodge that were not there that night. After the meeting I left feeling very unhappy and disgusted about the visit.

Exactly one week later I was at a meeting for the Masonic Board of Relief and the DDGM who is the president of that board again stated that he was a police officer and then proclaimed that he would use a law enforcement computer system to aid in investigating in any funny business. As a cop I have used this system and there isn't a lot of information that can't be found (i.e. SSN, DOB, addresses, etc.) I was so mad I tried to jump out of my seat to immediately confront him and I knocked over some chairs. My lodge Brother grabbed my shoulder and told me to stop and think about my actions. I did and I just stood up, apologized to the brethren for the distraction and excused myself from the meeting.

How can I deal with this person in the proper manner as he has lied to two rooms, full of MM that I know of, I'm sure there are more. This is unacceptable and this person no longer has my respect due to his lack of integrity. We are supposed to take each other's word at face value because we are MM but if you do nothing but lie how can you adjudicate someone else's failings and render judgement upon their masonic offenses if so required.

Then there is the non masonic problem: As a former police officer once people find out that you are or were a cop, they ask all kinds of legal or law related questions. If this happens, which I'm positive it will soon enough as I get those questions from my brothers all the time, he will have two choices:

#1 To come clean and tell them that he is a liar, which I am positive he won't due since he seems to love the authority that come with his status as a DDGM and would be charged with masonic offenses and tossed from the fraternity.

#2 He gives them advise which would be based more on a Hollywood movie than actual experience or understanding of the laws, in Missouri, which he doesn't have. At that point now people who are my fellow brothers are in a position that may lead to arrest or worse injury/death based on the belief that he is giving sound advise.

I need some different approaches to this problem so that I may be better able to serve and protect my brothers and freemasonry as a whole.

Thank you for your time.
 

Glen Cook

G A Cook
Site Benefactor
First, subdue your passions. Jumping out of your chair and knocking things over makes you look like a hot head.

Get a sense of perspective. Okay, he’s a liar. Whats for dinner? It really doesn’t effect you.

If you feel impelled to do so, the next time he has a Q and A, ask him politely which department he works for. If you want, PM me his name, and I will ask him

As to people asking you legal questions, explain you aren’t an attorney and move on. Not that hard.
 

MO-AF&AM-3

Registered User
Thank you Bro. Cook. You are probably right. My feeling is that of pride, in the amount of blood sweat and tears it took to become a police officer and for someone to so flippantly make claims that he did not earn, irked me something awful. I will remember my obligation to not lie to another MM and move on.
 

Matt L

Site Benefactor
I have 34 years on the job, and a prior service Marine. I've run into fake Police Officers and others that claimed military service among the craft. I get the pride thing. Brother Glen has given you sound advice. Be the better man.
 

MO-AF&AM-3

Registered User

I appreciate the advice. Here in STL the police gave had a heck of a rough time the past couple of years. I just wish the GL would do a better job of filtering out these types of folks. I think when we are tethered to folks that make these fake claims and then post hateful and incendiary views of police and the U.S. to social media while also posting he holds a high position within the craft on that same outlet, I believe it only hurts us all and gives the impression that these are sanctioned views of the GL and begin to question my commitment to the organization.
 

Glen Cook

G A Cook
Site Benefactor
“these types of folks“ are those who post comments critical of the police? Luckily, my masonry doesn’t filter out such people.

We can leave for another time whether DDGM is a “high“ position.
 

Bloke

Premium Member
"Rank is but a guinea stamp, the man himself the gold"

Assuming DDGM is District Deputy Grand Master, you might go to the District Grand Master and say you have a problem you are lookking for advice for - then ask some advice on how to deal with this or if you should just let it be. Doing that, even if he says do nothing, would put this issue on his radar...

What do other Brethren think ?
 

MO-AF&AM-3

Registered User
“these types of folks“ are those who post comments critical of the police? Luckily, my masonry doesn’t filter out such people.

We can leave for another time whether DDGM is a “high“ position.
I'm sorry, my post was unclear. This person isn't critical of the police, heck cops can be the most ardent critics of their comrades. By filtering these guys out what I meant was a better vetting of candidates to represent our fraternity. I do not be live in excluding based on opinions and free speech but what would appear to advocate for violence is what I believe to be a disqualifying factor.

More like he is saying that the police are inherently racist and murder people without due process and that "America has alway killed black men and always will just like the police murdered Michael Brown" "Land of the free and home of the brave, my ass"

I worked the line in Ferguson, MO for months and had all kinds of fluids tossed at me based on that type of language. That's a pretty bad feeling to have when I am one of those guys he is calling an awful person. Since he speaks for the Grand Master I'm my district, then he speaks for all of freemasonry in Missouri or at least that's how it was explained to me. I really thank you brothers for the chance to share my thoughts with you. As strange as this may sound this is very helpful.
 

MO-AF&AM-3

Registered User
"Rank is but a guinea stamp, the man himself the gold"

Assuming DDGM is District Deputy Grand Master, you might go to the District Grand Master and say you have a problem you are lookking for advice for - then ask some advice on how to deal with this or if you should just let it be. Doing that, even if he says do nothing, would put this issue on his radar...

What do other Brethren think ?
Yes it is district deputy grand master. I really do appreciate your advice. Its really a good thing that you and brother cook let me bounce this problem off of you. I really do enjoy the craft immensely, I have felt this kind of commraderie since my time in the military and with the police department and wish it a long and prosperous future with me in it. I can only hope that I haven't upset anyone and that you all know that I am taking in all the advice given to me and working out the problem in my head. Your wisdom hasn't been lost on me. Thank you brothers. Be safe out there and have a Merry Christmas.
 

Glen Cook

G A Cook
Site Benefactor
I'm sorry, my post was unclear. This person isn't critical of the police, heck cops can be the most ardent critics of their comrades. By filtering these guys out what I meant was a better vetting of candidates to represent our fraternity. I do not be live in excluding based on opinions and free speech but what would appear to advocate for violence is what I believe to be a disqualifying factor.

More like he is saying that the police are inherently racist and murder people without due process and that "America has alway killed black men and always will just like the police murdered Michael Brown" "Land of the free and home of the brave, my ass"

I worked the line in Ferguson, MO for months and had all kinds of fluids tossed at me based on that type of language. That's a pretty bad feeling to have when I am one of those guys he is calling an awful person. Since he speaks for the Grand Master I'm my district, then he speaks for all of freemasonry in Missouri or at least that's how it was explained to me. I really thank you brothers for the chance to share my thoughts with you. As strange as this may sound this is very helpful.
You are saying that the statement “America has alway killed black men and always will just like the police murdered Michael Brown" "Land of the free and home of the brave, my ass…” is advocating violence.

I agree that America has always killed black men. I don’t know if they always will, but I don’t gainsay the statement. I didn’t hear the evidence in the Michael Brown case.

You have now moved from claiming the brother mason is not law enforcement to a dislike of his views.

It appears you do not like criticism of the police and you do wish to exclude based on opinions.

He didn’t call you awful person, unless you were involved in the Michael Brown matter.

Really, it seems you are too wound up over this.
 

Glen Cook

G A Cook
Site Benefactor
"Rank is but a guinea stamp, the man himself the gold"

Assuming DDGM is District Deputy Grand Master, you might go to the District Grand Master and say you have a problem you are lookking for advice for - then ask some advice on how to deal with this or if you should just let it be. Doing that, even if he says do nothing, would put this issue on his radar...

What do other Brethren think ?
The next step would be the GM.
 

MO-AF&AM-3

Registered User
Fair enough, I just felt that the views being espoused and the lies being told were part of a larger issue that paints the whole lot of us as a quasi militant group, that damages the integrity of the craft and if you wish to grow a fraternal organization, which every GL wants to do I think this kind of rhetoric is counterproductive to those aims and goals. I am expected to conduct myself according to the principles of freemasonry, as are every other brother. I take my oaths and obligations very seriously.

As far as America goes people are the ones that murder not the country as a whole. I have been to many other countries due to my time in the military and trust me you don't want to be subjected to their system of laws and rules.
 

Glen Cook

G A Cook
Site Benefactor
I don’t see recognising that this country was founded on the institution of slavery, humans as only a part of a person, and that we really do kill people of colour to be militant. Indeed, to claim otherwise is more concerning to me.

Not wanting to kill people of colour really seems the opposite of militant.

I assure you, I take my obligations seriously as well, and any intimation to the contrary will meet with the strongest resistance.

Other than your suspicion that he is not LE, I see nothing contrary to the principles of Freemasonry.

You are not the only one who has travelled widely. I was in Spain during Franco. I am retired military.

Really, it is quite clear you just don’t like what he is saying. While I can only rely on hearsay as to the actual comment, I see nothing inconsistent with the principles of Freemasonry.
 

MO-AF&AM-3

Registered User
Well I guess we just have to agree to disagree as I like to think that despite all of our past history and problems we are still the best, most generous and fair-minded country to have grace the earth. I do appreciate your insight and thank you for your time responding to my post. I would also like to thank you for your service. Have a Merry Christmas and be safe out there traveler.
 

Glen Cook

G A Cook
Site Benefactor
Well I guess we just have to agree to disagree as I like to think that despite all of our past history and problems we are still the best, most generous and fair-minded country to have grace the earth. I do appreciate your insight and thank you for your time responding to my post. I would also like to thank you for your service. Have a Merry Christmas and be safe out there traveler.
And it is fine to disagree.
I find Canada, Scotland, England, Ireland … to exhibit those qualities as well, and indeed, in some matters such as race, more so.

I get two thank you deposits a month. I appreciate you paying your taxes!
 
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