The Philosophy of "Making Good Men Better"

Discussion in 'Philosophy, Religion and Spirituality' started by pointwithinacircle2, Sep 15, 2015.

  1. jermy Bell

    jermy Bell Registered User

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    I with draw my comment.
     
    Last edited: Mar 11, 2017
  2. Ripcord22A

    Ripcord22A Site Benefactor

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  3. JamestheJust

    JamestheJust Registered User

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  4. Brother JC

    Brother JC Vigilant Staff Member

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    The pigpen cypher is extremely common. I learned it in the scouts and taught it in the navy. I've used on event posters and other graphics as well.
     
  5. Bloke

    Bloke Premium Member

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    I saw a CA ritual book the other day..... looked tricky....
     
  6. Brother JC

    Brother JC Vigilant Staff Member

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    Mm, yeah, I see your point there. It still makes me cross eyed looking at it. NM is fairly straightforward so CA was a bit of a shock.
     
  7. Warrior1256

    Warrior1256 Site Benefactor

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    I was asking wondering this myself!
     
  8. coachn

    coachn Coach John S. Nagy Premium Member

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    Only when you are not doing the Work. When you do the Work, you tend to filter out a lot of BS fairly quickly.
    Yeah, in an ideal world. But, as you might have gathered, Freemasonry doesn't support this.
    LOL! Not if the light's on and no one's home. I know members who have gone to their graves buying into this "stuff" you shared never getting deeper than the rubbish that's shoved their way by others. Deeper meaning comes with Work, not time.
    I call shenanigans! Who is this "we"? It sounds all warm and goey, but it's not sticking to the wall.
    Who is this "our" of which you speak? I have yet to actually practice anything that was actual provided Freemasonic teachings. All of it is training. There's a huge difference.
    Copy? Sacred Truth? One True Form?
    Who is this "We" and how are you defining "perfect"?
    Gees! Could I please get a small hint of what you are smokin'?
     
  9. Bloke

    Bloke Premium Member

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    ( Hey Coach, you will like this one...a while back in here there was some lovely story or post or something, and we're (including me) all replying with approval; sorry, can't remember details but Freemasonry(Masonry in nod to you) was the hero. You made some comment, not inappropriate but slightly not like the rest, and I realised, we were all being very sentimental while you were being VERY rationalist... just thought I'd let you know in the hope you might take that as a complement.... i'm starting to see it as a divide within Freemasonry ( like and other "divide", skin colour, religion, wealth, politics etcetera ) but still just part of our tapestry)
     
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  10. 88DAM88

    88DAM88 Registered User

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    I find that we should be concerned with quality not quantity when it comes to Lodge membership. We should guard that West Gate closely. We should be a fraternity striving to "make good men better." not make men good men. I feel that there one should be at a certain level of character and spirit before even being considered. I like this paraphrased text from an article by L. Vallejos in Elephant Journal. We should be looking for good men to bring in, not collecting dues from nice guys:
    ____________________________________________________________

    Are you a Nice Guy or a Good Man?

    If that seems like an odd question, bear with me for a moment, because there is a distinct difference between the two.

    A nice guy will tell a pretty lie to avoid the discomfort of telling an ugly truth.
    A good man will deliver the truth, however unpleasant, because his integrity will not let him deceive anyone for his own comfort.

    A nice guy will do nice things with unspoken expectations attached. He will take a woman on a date, expecting to get something in return.
    A good man does things without expectation of a payoff, but because he is acting in accordance with his core values. Should he receive a return—it’s simply a bonus.

    A nice guy is worried about his reputation, but a good man is only concerned with his character.

    A nice guy fears rejection and so he seeks validation.
    A good man is self-validated and does not tie his worth to whether he is accepted or rejected.

    A nice guy will cloak his intentions and be unclear, while a good man will be upfront with his intentions and be very clear about his aim.
    The good man leaves no space for ambiguity.

    A nice guy will have loose boundaries and will bend over backwards just to seem nice. A good man has clear boundaries and, thus, earns the respect of the people around him.

    A nice guy will smother his current love interest and will make her the center of his universe.
    A good man will give appropriate attention to a lover without becoming overbearing or taking over her life.

    A nice guy will blame others, circumstances, or fate for his lot in life.
    A good man recognizes his role in whatever has transpired, takes responsibility and, when necessary, redirects his course.

    A nice guy will make lofty promises to look good.
    A good man will only make the promises he knows he can keep.

    A nice guy wants to play the knight in shining armor, but is quick to disappear when sh*t gets real.
    A good man knows it’s not his job to rescue anyone but will show up and have your back when needed.

    A nice guy will discard anything and anyone that is no longer useful to him.
    A good man will respect another persons’ inherent dignity and treat them kindly even when they no longer have a role or purpose in his life-plan.

    A nice guy lacks leadership abilities and is content to let others guide his life.
    A good man takes charge of his life and becomes the master of his own fate.

    A nice guy will do anything to avoid hurting someone’s feelings.
    A good man realizes that sometimes, the kindest thing one can do for another may initially be hurtful, but will eventually be helpful.

    A nice guy will say what others want to hear.
    A good man will say what others need to hear.

    A nice guy won’t apologize even when he’s wrong because he thinks it makes him weak.
    A good man is quick with apologies and even faster with reparations.

    A nice guy lives in service of himself and his desires.
    A good man lives in service of humanity.

    At the core, the major difference between a nice guy and a good man is that a nice guy is concerned with appearances and etiquette.
    The good man is concerned with character and morality.

    The nice guy takes the easy road.
    The good man is committed to his development and is willing to do the work to become a better man.
    The good man realizes that he is not going to get there by taking shortcuts, in life, business, or relationships.

    The good man will do the work, and reap the benefits.
    A nice guy looks on in envy.

    If you’re a nice guy, it’s okay. You can become a good man.

    Start by speaking your truth, owning your life and choices, and start living for a higher purpose.

    Start making decisions that align with being a good man. Change your approach to living.

    If you’re a good man—thank you. The world needs more of you.
     
    Last edited: Aug 4, 2017
    Bill Lins and coachn like this.
  11. coachn

    coachn Coach John S. Nagy Premium Member

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    Just saw this. AWESOME! Thank You! (and KUDOS!)
     
  12. hanzosbm

    hanzosbm Premium Member

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    I know I'm a bit late to this party, but as I recently presented a paper on exactly this topic, I couldn't help but add on. Most of the paper discussed our teachings a little too in depth for me to post here, but one of the conclusions I came to was the Freemasonry does NOT make good men better. Rather, it gives good men the tools to make themselves better.
     
  13. Warrior1256

    Warrior1256 Site Benefactor

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    I like this!
     
  14. Pointwithinacircle3

    Pointwithinacircle3 Registered User

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    Perhaps guarding the West gate means keeping out people who are not prepared for better tools. ?????
     
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  15. Warrior1256

    Warrior1256 Site Benefactor

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    It seems to me that you wouldn't know this until after they are members. This is where "wise council" would come in.
     
  16. jermy Bell

    jermy Bell Registered User

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    I'm' still curious on this one., all I'm ever told is go to these schools we put on, you need to learn the rod, and floor work. This will make me a better man and mason ? You need to come to these schools we put on and learn ritual, and learn the lectures. This will make me a better man and a mason ? (The famously deer in the head light look) so, how does one explain to a new brother how to be a better man and a mason, when we can' get past ritual and floor work ?
     
  17. Bloke

    Bloke Premium Member

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    I guess my responds would be something about self-discipline and understand Freemasonry by learning its ritual..... but there are many paths to being a good Freemason, some of the best ones I know are not really interested in ritual, but they live it's messages.
     
  18. Pointwithinacircle3

    Pointwithinacircle3 Registered User

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    Learning the ritual and the floor work will perpetuate the the system. While perpetuating the system a man may (or may not) become a better man. It makes me wonder, how shall we define "a good man"? Is there an objective standard or does each man set his own standard? Is becoming a good man something a man can do on his own or does it require (or possibly, is it made easier by) interaction with other men?
     
    jermy Bell likes this.
  19. Brother JC

    Brother JC Vigilant Staff Member

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    The lessons you were given during the degrees contain the tools you need. The floorwork is to pass those lessons on to the next candidates.
     
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  20. JamestheJust

    JamestheJust Registered User

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    >how shall we define "a good man"?

    When we learn to use the "working tools" in a moral sense we are able to measure trueness to the GAOTU.
     

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