Would u return the sign

Discussion in 'The Voting Booth' started by Bboc, Sep 14, 2010.

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Would you return the sign? Answer honestly.

  1. Yes I would.

    22.2%
  2. No I would not.

    65.3%
  3. I'm not a mason.

    4.2%
  4. We have signs?

    8.3%
  1. Brother Jason Eddy

    Brother Jason Eddy Registered User

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    While I would not return the sign, I find your virtuous perspective very honorable.
     
  2. Brother Jason Eddy

    Brother Jason Eddy Registered User

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    Perhaps this is a regional difference in terminology. In Ohio, we have both due guards and signs for each degree.
     
  3. Beathard

    Beathard Premium Member

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    Got it. My bad. Must be getting old. We have penal signs as well, duh!? Climbing back under my rock.
     
    Last edited: Apr 12, 2011
  4. Michaelstedman81

    Michaelstedman81 Premium Member

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    Just curious, but in the even that being stranded on the side of the road, would it be okay to give the penal sign of a EA, RC, or MM (as what I believe the original question is describing) or is that really frowned upon or not even allowed?
     
  5. Beathard

    Beathard Premium Member

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    I think being stranded on the side of the road in Texas heat with the crazy drivers out there is a life threatening situation that would put anyone in distress.
     
  6. Michaelstedman81

    Michaelstedman81 Premium Member

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    Hhhahahah
     
  7. MikeMay

    MikeMay Premium Member

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    Brother, with the heat in Texas, it can be just as stressful "not" being stranded on the highways...I'm still working on cleaning up my vocabulary while driving in traffic. ;-)
     
  8. choppersteve03

    choppersteve03 Premium Member

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    it says here in my e.a. study work that, the word and grip are our means of recognition when among strangers and in distant places, then it goes on to say. the right of salutation is the respectful salute given by canidates and members, and it is a means of signifying their acceptance of the authority of the princeable officers. so to me that means if someone gives me the sign i would not return it, because where not in the lodge and i dont know if dude is a princeable officer or not, you cant be thrown up due guards and signs from a moving car. plus iam with brother bruce, where i come from you get dealt with quick in Oakland CA, for throwing up signs, way too many gangstas.
     
  9. AnthonyBolding

    AnthonyBolding Registered User

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    I wouldn't. That is not a public thing to do whether he is pha or Grand Lodge of Texas.
     
  10. Ashlar

    Ashlar Registered User

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    No I would not . I have had Due guards and signs given to me in public and all I did was nod my head and smile .
     
  11. bullrack33

    bullrack33 Premium Member

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    I would not give any signs in public. Think about it this way, one of the reasons that a Entered Apprentice is not allowed into a Fellowcraft or Masters Lodge is because the signs are given and an EA is not privy to them.

    The Due Guards and Penal Signs are to be kept from the uninitiated.
     
  12. Huw

    Huw Guest

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    Certainly not. This is nothing to do with what jurisdiction the other guy belongs to (if any - he might be a fake!), but simply because it's not proper to give a Sn in public.

    If I need to test someone who tells me he's a Brother, then I'll find somewhere private for it, not the public street. And that's darn rare, I've only had proper cause to do this a couple of times in nearly 20 years of membership.

    T & F,

    Huw
     
  13. dnewman3

    dnewman3 Registered User

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    This leads to another question.....how have you been approached or approached someone else to allude to their existance in the "ranks"

    My self...have passed a token....and had it returned. But after i saw the "bling". Or have asked a leading question.
     
  14. Ashlar

    Ashlar Registered User

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    I do not approach strangers in public who happen to be wearing Masonic insignia's just "for the heck of it" . If it is a brother I know I will say hello . If I know them well , I will strike up a conversation . But I do not actively look for Masonic rings , shirts or hats and if I do notice them I will not actively engage in conversation just because they are Masons . I have been asked leading questions by strangers , but I don't ask them myself , even if I am talking directly to them . Do not take me wrong , I will hold a pleasant conversation with a fellow Mason if he so wishes , I will tell him what lodge I belong to , but I will not speak Masonicly outside of a lodge setting as there is no need for it .

    I do not give signs , passes or grips outside of lodge and I would never do it to a stranger . Suppose you notice a ring , walk up and give him a grip and it happens that this man is wearing his (Grand)Father's ring and is not a Mason or is clandestine , then you have violated your OB . I have a young couple down the road from me who purchased an old used car that is covered in Masonic decals from the previous owner , suppose you drive by them and give them the sign of an EA or it is the wife of a Mason or the son of a Mason , you have violated your OB . This is why there is a time and place for these types of things , rings , hats , shirts , car decals may be purchased on the internet by anyone who so wishes to buy them , you have Old Navy selling t-shirts with the SR double headed eagle , you have that Jay Z selling clothes with Masonic imagery on them so we should exercise caution when in public . This is why I do not approach men wearing the S & C as I do not take it for granted that they are true and lawful brother Masons .

    And if you must give a sign , grip and word while in public , make sure it is in private and that you have seen a dues card or some other form of validation first or have sat in lodge with them .
     
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2011
  15. Brian Morton

    Brian Morton Registered User

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    Great response but I do see a great conversation starter with rings, decals, and the like. That's why there's challenges to weed out the profane.
     
  16. Raymond Walters

    Raymond Walters Premium Member

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    SMH;

    because if a person is in distress of some kind, they are seeking assistance? Is it not our duty as Freemason's to offer aid to another Freemason and as human beings to offer aid in general. In fact, I recall that our ritual and charges say we are to show preferment to our brother masons first and above the general public.

    And can't a person's masonic standing be gathered discreetly when in a public setting? I advocate that it can if you are truly conversant in the ritual of your jurisdiction, and have made study of Freemasonry in general. This would prevent you from violating your obligations.

    There are ways outside of the standard Q & A you may have been taught to ascertain a true brother, and I maintain that questions outside of the "norm" may be safer ways to determine a true brother from an imposter in a public setting.

    As an earlier post commented, a person could be an imposter, yet, I maintain that same imposter with a sign or a grip will not have the things that go with that sign or grip(if they are an imposter). If a person has never sat in a lodge, they will not be able to tell you things that anyone who has sat in a lodge will know.

    Hence, questions outside of the norm may help spot an imposter from the true even quicker, and those questions would be permissible in public, and negate a person from violating their obligations.

    I get so puzzled at some the responses I see/read, and how things in our obligations get so twisted into something unrecognizable to the average mason.

    Side note: I stopped once to assist a brother mason, who happened to be white (which for me didn't matter). He had such a problem with me being Black, and acknowledging/ responding to him as a Freemason that he turned his masonic ring upside down so that the masonic emblem couldn't be seen from the top of his finger.

    Now, I was a member of the so-called "mainstream" Grand Lodge system at the time, but he never bothered to find out where I hailed from, he made an assumption, and therein is the biggest problem I see with these one-sided viewpoints regarding our obligations.

    In the end, it appears that it is a personal choice whether to acknowledge any masonic signs or to render aid or how to go about it. That's the only point I seek to make, and am not interested in prolonged personal debate on this topic. I have simply offered an opinion, just as others have done on this same topic.

    Respect my opinion as I have respected yours. (I feel this was a required comment since I have certain individuals on this forum that always want to challenge my opinions on subjects up for discussion) Why? Because none of you know me or the personal hell I went through to earn the title "Master Mason".

    I thank the original poster of the question, because it was an interesting question(in my opinion).
     
    Last edited: Sep 2, 2011
  17. JTM

    JTM "Just in case" Premium Member

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    Please remember that "tone" isn't easily conveyed over text.

    No harm was meant.

    Either way, this is an internet forum, I would expect opinions to be challenged on a regular basis. There is no malicious intent that I've seen here. If you feel that there is, please report the post immediately (it's okay to report mods, me, and blake, too!) and we'll look into it.

    Carry on, gents.
     
  18. Plustax

    Plustax Registered User

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    I recall years ago while in the military (Ft Sill, OK) of a black woman coming up to me at a ball game and gving me a MM token. Talk about getting caught off guard.... LOL Of course I said or returned nothing & she proceeded to recite & say things that just threw me for a loop. I had never encountered anything like this so it definitely threw me for a loop & left me dumbfounded. I also recall a young black boy (maybe 13), notice my ring & proceeded to try & give me a token as well & try to have a conversation with other modes of recgnition. He got very frustrated with me when I kept saying I had no idea what he was talking about. I think I must have been a "clandy magnet" for a few years. LOL
     
  19. scialytic

    scialytic Premium Member

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    It is not *only* in Lodge after you know ***HE*** has received the degree in a r&dcL, etc. You must KNOW before commencing in Masonic modes of communication. But in a Lodge is one instance where you can be sure he is a true Brother.
     
  20. BroBook

    BroBook Premium Member

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    That's the only way to spot us/y'all !!!! now to get around the pretender I was taught not to follow or mimic and never try anybody who isn't trying you ! But why did this person flash you? Did they need help or guidance ? Yes flashing the wrong sign in the right place could get you felled on the spot but there is a difference between being discreet and scared!!!


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