Visitation Between Prince Hall and Regular Lodges

Re: Visitation Between Prince Hall and Regular Lod

tomasball said:

I'll agree with that. But I am hearing other members of this forum opining that since the GLoT got through their communication without voting for visitation, it's a conspiracy.

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My take is that it shows that it is up to the membership not to the leadership. Waiting on the leadership has taken years without result. Now it is time to author, sign and submit legislation directly to bring the matter to vote on the floor at the annual communication. Here is what I see as the steps -

1) Find the exact wording of what was passed on the floor at MWPHGLofTX a few weeks ago.

2) Find the exact wording of the committee report that was not read on the floor at GLofTX last week.

3) Write legislation to go through the proposal process.

4) Get the legislation signed by many and presented through the proposal process.

5) Vote on it on the floor one year from now.

6) If the leadership wants to get it done earlier than that, let them do so but keep the vote on the floor no matter what. The time for the leadership to accomplish this task has come and gone.

Re: Visitation Between Prince Hall and Regular Lod

What do you want to legislate? We've already formally empowered our Committee on Fraternal Relations to negotiate an amendment to the Compact to allow visitation. Short of writing the amendment yourself, what do you want?

Re: Visitation Between Prince Hall and Regular Lod

Couldn't somebody please post the text of the resolution that passed MWPHGLoT? Is there a reason that's not possible?

Re: Visitation Between Prince Hall and Regular Lod

tomasball said:

What do you want to legislate? We've already formally empowered our Committee on Fraternal Relations to negotiate an amendment to the Compact to allow visitation. Short of writing the amendment yourself, what do you want?

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Is it possible for what happened this year to happen again and again in the future? That is, a formal committee's report and thus empowerment can be diminished by not being able to speak at Grand Lodge?

Re: Visitation Between Prince Hall and Regular Lod

The business about abbreviating the Committe on Fraternal Relations report isn't as sinister as people are making it. They were making most of the Grand Lodge Committees just submit their report in writing without giving them floor time. The only thing CoFR had that required action was recognition for Tahiti. It is my understanding that as far as PH recognition is concerned, all they had to report was that there wasn't anything to report. I would be happy if those who have actually read the report contradicted me.

Re: Visitation Between Prince Hall and Regular Lod

tomasball said:

What do you want to legislate? We've already formally empowered our Committee on Fraternal Relations to negotiate an amendment to the Compact to allow visitation. Short of writing the amendment yourself, what do you want?

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Waiting for leadership to move forward has resulted in frustration - That empowerment happened years ago and there has been no movement. They are in reactive mode and they accept that the ball is not in their court at the moment.

Doing it ourselves does not depend on the leadership - As they have not already taken the proactive approach I want legislation written to offer visitation. That legislation can be written by me, by any other Texas brother or group of brothers in this forum, or by any other Texas brother or group of brothers in contact with this forum.

I suggest the time is past to wait for the leadership to make progress on their time scale. Write, sign, submit, vote.

Re: Visitation Between Prince Hall and Regular Lod

Well, no. It can't be written by "me, or any other Texas brother." Legislation can only be submitted by a member of Grand Lodge, or by a Lodge.

Re: Visitation Between Prince Hall and Regular Lod

tomasball said:

The business about abbreviating the Committe on Fraternal Relations report isn't as sinister as people are making it. They were making most of the Grand Lodge Committees just submit their report in writing without giving them floor time. The only thing CoFR had that required action was recognition for Tahiti. It is my understanding that as far as PH recognition is concerned, all they had to report was that there wasn't anything to report. I would be happy if those who have actually read the report contradicted me.

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Hmm I see. I wasn't there, only getting second-hand reports. Perhaps the visitation issue isn't as hot of a topic across the state as we think it might be? I know in my lodge, I'm pretty sure I'm the only one who ever discusses it at any length.

Re: Visitation Between Prince Hall and Regular Lod

tomasball said:

Well, no. It can't be written by "me, or any other Texas brother." Legislation can only be submitted by a member of Grand Lodge, or by a Lodge.

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Notice that you used two different verbs. "Written" for the process of assembling words for an intended meaning. "Submitted" for the sequence of gathering the correct signatures, submitting through the GL legislation process, being ready to speak for it on the floor. Knowing my status in the jurisdiction I did chose my verb carefully as did you. Thanks for the additional clarification on who is needed for each of the verbs.

I don't care who writes and who submits as long as it is done in time well before next year's annual communication. Signatures from willing brothers who are members of the Grand Lodge to be found and gathered as a part of that sequence.

Re: Visitation Between Prince Hall and Regular Lod

I'm more than happy to submit that legislation, as I'm sure any number of brothers would be. Let's get this ball rolling.

Re: Visitation Between Prince Hall and Regular Lod

Mac said:

I'm more than happy to submit that legislation, as I'm sure any number of brothers would be. Let's get this ball rolling.

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I would like to know the exact wording passed by MWPHGLofTX several weeks ago, but it will look somewhat like this -

Whereas the Most Worshipful Prince Hall Grand Lodge of Texas has been recognized for several years by the Grand Lodge of Texas, the United Grand Lodge of England and many other regular and recognized jurisdictions, and

Whereas there has previously been in place a custom recognition compact in place between the Most Worshipful Prince Hall Grand Lodge of Texas and the Grand Lodge of Texas, which compact did not include visitation, and

Whereas standard recognition compact between regular and recognized jurisdictions includes visitation, dual affiliation with jurisdictions that support dual affiliation and all of the traditional amenities between regular and recognized jurisdictions, therefore

Be it resolved that the Grand Lodge of Texas offer the Most Worshipful Prince Hall Grand Lodge of Texas the full standard and traditional compact of recognition to bring our jurisdictions from partial amity to full amity.

Respectfully submitted,

Lots of signatures of WMs, SWs, JWs, PMs, DDGMs and various other enthusiasts

Cc: Committee on Fraternal Relations, Committee on Legislation, Grand Secretary's office, elected grand line officers, (MWPHGLofTX Grand Secretary?)

Re: Visitation Between Prince Hall and Regular Lod

I'm beginning to wonder why we can't see the text of what was supposedly passed at the PH MidWinter concerning visitation. We've been posting the details of everything that happened at Waco...is there some reason we're not aware of that this can't be made available?

Re: Visitation Between Prince Hall and Regular Lod

tomasball said:

I'm beginning to wonder why we can't see the text of what was supposedly passed at the PH MidWinter concerning visitation. We've been posting the details of everything that happened at Waco...is there some reason we're not aware of that this can't be made available?

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Keep in mind that things are done differently between our jurisdictions. Our resolutions are not published like yours are. What dfreybur posted was pretty spot on. I do hope you understand.

Sincerely and Fraternally

Re: Visitation Between Prince Hall and Regular Lod

You all vote on resolutions without seeing them in writing? Perhaps you could describe what it said? Did it instruct your committee on Fraternal Relations to take particular actions, or did it offer a specific textual amendment to the compact?

Re: Visitation Between Prince Hall and Regular Lod

Did the PH resolution include affiliation and transfer of memberships?

Re: Visitation Between Prince Hall and Regular Lod

It did not.

Sincerely and Fraternally

Re: Visitation Between Prince Hall and Regular Lod

Okay...I assume you were answering my last question about affiliation and transfer of membership. Was that stuff discussed and rejected, or was it not brought up at all?

Tom Ball 33*
PM 1173, 1010

Re: Visitation Between Prince Hall and Regular Lod

It wasnt even brought up.

Sincerely and Fraternally

Well it's may now . Have we any news on this ?


Sent From My Freemasonry Pro App

Txmason32 said:

Well it's may now . Have we any news on this ?

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May is the deadline to submit legislation or the Dec annual communication. I posted in another thread the exact wording I will submit at my own lodge this week. If more lodges copy, sign and submit I would like that.