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dfreybur

Premium Member
I strongly disagree with this, Brother. How would you feel if you're a Christian and were given a Quran? It doesn't align with your own beliefs at all. There's a reason why they're denominated as the VSL in our work. I sincerely hope that brothers there were obligated on the VSL of their own faith otherwise their SO wouldn't be as solemn as they thought it would be.

If I were a member of a religion not in the local majority and the lodge gave me a book of scripture from the local majority religion, I would ponder on that. Masonry admits men who have some religion. We don't ask which religion it is. We are not permitted to discuss religion in our meanings. While my Brothers may well have learned my religion there's no formal mechanism to deal with that. I would be rather impressed that it worked out that way.

If I were a member of a religion not in the local majority and I asked the lodge to be obligated on the book of scripture of my own religion, I'd be impressed they were okay with that (I've been at degrees with Koran or Gita). Should they also go get a copy to present to me, I would be impressed that it worked out that way.

If my obligations were taken in a Muslim majority country I would find it natural and obvious that I be presented with a Koran.

Understand that the physical book on the altar is a symbol of the book that's in the heart of each one of us. For many of us the book in our heart is not the same as the physical one on the altar. The physical one on the altar represents all, but is selected based on local demographics not on the choice of any one of us. Aligning with our beliefs is entirely about the one in our hearts. Never lose track of that.
 
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CLewey44

Registered User
I would proudly accept whatever VSL was presented to me i whatever country I was in. I know my beliefas but to me, apart of the Masonic journey is understanding others VSL and/or beliefs. How can I expect to be accepted if I myself am not accepting of others?
 

Warrior1256

Site Benefactor
Understand that the physical book on the altar is a symbol of the book that's in the heart of each own of us. For many of us the book in our heart is not the same as the physical one on the altar. The physical one on the altar represents all, but is selected based on local demographics not on the choice of any one of us. Aligning with our beliefs is entirely about the one in our hearts. Never lose track of that.
I would proudly accept whatever VSL was presented to me i whatever country I was in. I know my beliefas but to me, apart of the Masonic journey is understanding others VSL and/or beliefs. How can I expect to be accepted if I myself am not accepting of others?
Great answers Brothers.
 

EVG Yumul

Registered User
Would you explain why the VSL makes a difference in the solemnity of the ob.? What about those who accept no particular VSL? Are they doomed to a less than solemn ob.?

A mason takes his SO on the VSL of his faith because he is making a promise to his creator that he will be faithful to his obligations. This oath between the mason and his Supreme Being is evidenced by his taking of his SO on the book of his faith. In other jurisdictions, such as ours, we keep a special blank book for those brothers who have a belief in a Supreme Being but believe that no one religion can define him. That's what he uses in his SO.
 

Warrior1256

Site Benefactor
In other jurisdictions, such as ours, we keep a special blank book for those brothers who have a belief in a Supreme Being but believe that no one religion can define him. That's what he uses in his SO.
That is very interesting. Just goes to show the vast differences in religions and cultures.
 

Glen Cook

G A Cook
Site Benefactor
A mason takes his SO on the VSL of his faith because he is making a promise to his creator that he will be faithful to his obligations. This oath between the mason and his Supreme Being is evidenced by his taking of his SO on the book of his faith. In other jurisdictions, such as ours, we keep a special blank book for those brothers who have a belief in a Supreme Being but believe that no one religion can define him. That's what he uses in his SO.
Im aware of the practice. I was referring to the incorrect statement I quoted.

Also, blank book is not accepted in some jurisdictions as it does not reflect the revealed word of deity.
 

EVG Yumul

Registered User
If I were a member of a religion not in the local majority and I asked the lodge to be obligated on the book of scripture of my own religion, I'd be impressed they were okay with that (I've been at degrees with Koran or Gita). Should they also go get a copy to present to me, I would be impressed that it worked out that way.

If my obligations were taken in a Muslim majority country I would find it natural and obvious that I be presented with a Koran.

Point taken, Brother. Thank you for your feedback. I guess I just find the practice odd since we don't present VSLs in our jurisdiction. :)
 

EVG Yumul

Registered User
I would proudly accept whatever VSL was presented to me i whatever country I was in. I know my beliefas but to me, apart of the Masonic journey is understanding others VSL and/or beliefs. How can I expect to be accepted if I myself am not accepting of others?

Again, another good point, brother. Thank you for that. Universal brotherhood is one of the tenets our fraternity was founded on and I wholly agree with you. I just find the practise of handing out VSLs a bit peculiar. :)
 

EVG Yumul

Registered User
Also, blank book is not accepted in some jurisdictions as it does not reflect the revealed word of deity.

I made that argument too, Brother. But a PAGM told me that the reason it's still acceptable to do that in our jurisdiction is that faith in the heart supersede words on paper. He mentioned God can be found not just in a VSL, but within the heart of everyone of us.
 

EVG Yumul

Registered User
Understand that the physical book on the altar is a symbol of the book that's in the heart of each one of us. For many of us the book in our heart is not the same as the physical one on the altar. The physical one on the altar represents all, but is selected based on local demographics not on the choice of any one of us. Aligning with our beliefs is entirely about the one in our hearts. Never lose track of that.

It's interesting to note that in Singapore, lodges there have a multitude of VSLs that they open when they open their lodges. And thank you for your insight, brother. :)
 

dfreybur

Premium Member
A mason takes his SO on the VSL of his faith because he is making a promise to his creator that he will be faithful to his obligations. This oath between the mason and his Supreme Being is evidenced by his taking of his SO on the book of his faith.

That's a gigantic assumption. When I arrived at my first degree I had no idea there was going to be scripture present. I was told to put my hand on the Bible and my reaction was that it was nice they put one there. Some candidates know but it's definitely not a part of the preparation everywhere.

Just checking - If you think that an obligation isn't binding unless it's on a specific book I find that very disappointing. The book is a reminder, a reinforcement not an enabler.
 

EVG Yumul

Registered User
That's a gigantic assumption. When I arrived at my first degree I had no idea there was going to be scripture present. I was told to put my hand on the Bible and my reaction was that it was nice they put one there. Some candidates know but it's definitely not a part of the preparation everywhere.

Just checking - If you think that an obligation isn't binding unless it's on a specific book I find that very disappointing. The book is a reminder, a reinforcement not an enabler.

That is my Grand Lodge's interpretation and not just my own.
 

EVG Yumul

Registered User
That's a gigantic assumption. When I arrived at my first degree I had no idea there was going to be scripture present. I was told to put my hand on the Bible and my reaction was that it was nice they put one there. Some candidates know but it's definitely not a part of the preparation everywhere.

Just checking - If you think that an obligation isn't binding unless it's on a specific book I find that very disappointing. The book is a reminder, a reinforcement not an enabler.

I know that this is a really old topic but I found this in the Masonic Year Book of UGLE, this can also be found in the Book of Constitutions. This is one of the Basic Principles of Freemasonry that is used by the United Grand Lodge of England, the Grand Lodge of Ireland, and the Grand Lodge of Scotland:

"3. That all Initiates shall take their Obligation on or in full view of the open Volume of the Sacred Law, by which is meant the revelation from above which is binding on the conscience of the particular individual who is being initiated."

Source: https://www.ugle.org.uk/about/book-of-constitutions (Page XIV)
 

bro.william

Premium Member
from the perspective of an initiate: if i had received a VSL other than my own, I’d honour it in the spirit in which it was given.

from the perspective of one already raised whose lodge is responsible for these things: i would encourage my lodge to make available whatever VSL was appropriate and/or acceptable to the initiate‘s own sense of the divine.

generosity and courtesy in all things. it’s not rocket science.
 
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