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What do you tell the Anti Freemason?

VinnyC

Registered User
During table talk, what do you say to an Anti Freemason when he says things about it, such as it's a cult, devil lovers and wants to rule the world, etc...? But yet, he still doesn't know you are or even if you are.
 

cemab4y

Premium Member
I have researched Anti-Masonry for two decades. I have attended anti-Masonic conventions in St. Louis and Atlanta. I have written an article for the Scottish Rite Journal, on what I observed at the conventions. These people are convinced that Masonry:

Is a Cult.
Prays to the Devil (Satan)
Is a religion.
Set up the Shriner's hospitals so that Shriners can have access to children for sexual abuse.
Set up the Rainbow Girls, to serve as prostitutes for Shriners
Gets you to heaven
Mixes all religions together
performs animal and human sacrifices in Masonic temples
Baptize each other in Master Mason degree ceremonies
Performs marriages in Masonic temples
Preach each other into the "Celestial lodge"
Is planning to take over the world, and set up a one-world government
Uses masonic charities as a "deception" to cover the true nature of Masonry
and on, and on, and on.

Masonry, traditionally, has "turned the other cheek" to such attacks, and let the idiots who choose to believe this crap, to be happy in their ignorance.

What can you say to people who believe that Shriners perform sexual acts on crippled children? What can you say to people who say that Masons worship Satan in their lodges?

People who believe this drivel, are beyond convincing. Personally, I would like for some of the purveyors of this kind of filth, to be hit with a big lawsuit for defamation of character. We have enough lawyers, in Masonry, who would donate their time, to get a class-action lawsuit underway, and really nail these guys. We could even get the publishers of the books and tracts, to pay triple-damages under the RICO act.

CLICK HERE ->Objectors
 

fairmanjd

Registered User
Gentlemen:
I hope i am not out of place in replying; as I am but a petitioner and not even an EA yet. However, please allow me to humbly submit for your consideration that not defending the fraternity may be doin some harm. When my wife an I were prayerfully considering whether or not I should petition, one thing we talked about was the fact that Masons as a whole do not choose to defend the fraternity from such accusations and that in a way the fraternity is failing to visibly separate itself from that evil that many ignorant people associate with it.
I think it similar to when you see Muslims as a whole group condemned for the actions of a few radicals who's motivations were based on hate.... not the Quran. 99.99999 percent of Muslims are not terrorists; however, the failure of their congregation as a whole to stand up and publicly condemn those terrorist's actions with a great public voice greatly contributed to their persecution.
As I said, I am but a petitioner at this point; and I apologize if I speak out of turn and in ignorance of something you gentlemen know.
 

cemab4y

Premium Member
You are certainly not out of place at all. The decision to petition Freemasonry, is a serious one, and should be made "prayerfully and carefully". Freemasonry has many traditions and practices, and not all of them make sense to the outsider (not all of them make sense to me, either, and I have been a Mason for 28 years). Freemasonry traditionally, has ignored accusations of this sort. People who believe this drivel, are beyond convincing, so why try?

There is no incentive to separate Masonry from "evil", because there is no evil in Freemasonry. And your comparison to the Islamic religion is imprecise. I am in Afghanistan. I have lived in Saudi Arabia, Iraq, and Afghanistan. I have worked with Muslims, and lived under Islamic Sharia law. You are quite correct that the huge majority of Muslims abhor terrorism, and have no connection at all with terrorists. Does the failure of Muslims to more vigorously distance themselves from terrorism, prove harmful? Probably, yes. But most Muslim governments do not permit their citizens, the right of free speech. (Turn on the TV, and see what is happening in Egypt).

The wide majority of Masons, have no idea about what anti-Masons are saying about our Craft. They do not visit the anti-Masonic websites, nor do they go to the anti-Masonic conventions (I have been to two such conventions). When I tell Masons, that some people believe that we worship Satan, and that Shriners (all Shriners are Masons) perform disgusting sexual acts on crippled children in our hospitals, the Masons do not believe me.
 

coachn

Coach John S. Nagy
Premium Member
Naysons are collectively either a vice or superfluity or both.

My experience and the experience of others tells me that there is nothing that any Mason can tell a Nayson.

There is however a lot that Naysons can tell anyone whom asks.

If you don't believe me, just ask one.
 

JohnnyFlotsam

Premium Member
I tell them, "You can't prove what you are saying, because it is false, though you will almost certainly try, by citing the usual litany of discredited 'sources'. If you are interested in the truth, that is to say things which are supported by knowable facts, I can share that with you. Otherwise, you will believe what you choose to believe. Actually knowing the truth might be better."
 

Bro. Bennett

Premium Member
Isaiah 32:11 says: Shudder, you complacent ones; Tremble, you overconfident ones!
To this I say, stop allowing the world to look at our fraternity in the manner they do now as evil, yet we should stand United and show thru our Brotherly Love and Compasion, that we are truly a Good and Obedient Body of Believers that shall prevale in our actions....
 

jwhoff

Premium Member
Not very long ago one explained to my how EViel we were and how I really couldn't know the inside story since I was a smal time mason. And, of course, that he wasn't trying to offend me, rather to save my very soul.

I asked that he not beat himself up over trying to warn me and, I tried to assure him I only joined the fraternity so I could find my way around Washington, DC. And Rome, if I get there.
:huh:
 

QPZIL

Premium Member
For those that are dealing with people who oppose Masonry on a religious basis, give A Pilgrim's Path by John J. Robinson a read. I haven't read it myself, but I've heard it's the best book dealing with arguments from the religious right.
 

Hndrx

Premium Member
This is a topic of interest to me. I'm due for my EA on the 8th of February. I have lifelong friends/relatives that oppose Masonry strongly. I don't believe that I'm going to be able to ignore the issue.
 

Nate C.

Registered User
I try to point out that an organization composed of a sizeable representation of our founding fathers (national as well as state) that espouses free thinking and a belief in deity can't possibly live up to all of those conspiracy theories.

However, some folks just can't be reasoned with. When confronted with an irrational argument, I just decline to engage in the debate...and choose my company more carefully on future occasions.
 

Ashlar

Registered User
It does not matter what you say because most have their minds made up and it is a waste of breath for the most part .

I have seen some anti's who have changed their views on Freemasonry and even went on to become Freemasons themselves , but they are in a small minority .You can give them the books like "A Pilgrims Path" and/or "Is it True...." and they will simply call it disinformation and/or propaganda .

BUT , I still do not think we should "sit on our hands" and allow them to propagate the lies and allow those who are on the fence concerning Freemasonry to only get the anti's side of the story without any debunking of said lies . Our Charge says we are not to *argue* with those......... , I do not consider having a rational discussion as a violation of that Charge . In other words , we are to subdue our passions and not get into a screaming match with an anti , but keep a cool head and combat their lies with TRUTH .
 

Rell357

Registered User
Gentlemen:
I hope i am not out of place in replying; as I am but a petitioner and not even an EA yet. However, please allow me to humbly submit for your consideration that not defending the fraternity may be doin some harm. When my wife an I were prayerfully considering whether or not I should petition, one thing we talked about was the fact that Masons as a whole do not choose to defend the fraternity from such accusations and that in a way the fraternity is failing to visibly separate itself from that evil that many ignorant people associate with it.
I think it similar to when you see Muslims as a whole group condemned for the actions of a few radicals who's motivations were based on hate.... not the Quran. 99.99999 percent of Muslims are not terrorists; however, the failure of their congregation as a whole to stand up and publicly condemn those terrorist's actions with a great public voice greatly contributed to their persecution.
As I said, I am but a petitioner at this point; and I apologize if I speak out of turn and in ignorance of something you gentlemen know.

You make a very valid point, But I think, and maybe some other brothers may agree, the reason for us not actively defending the fraternity is because those who choose to talk negatively about us would of course ask for "proof" that their accusations are false. And part of providing this "proof" would be to disclose our secrets to those who have not earned the right to our knowledge which we have earned as freemasons. And you will learn, during your first degree, one of the MOST important lessons about masonry is that you will NOT write, print, paint, stamp, stain, hue, cut, carve, mark, or engrave any of the secrets of freemasonry.
 

Dave in Waco

Premium Member
I just simply tell them, "That's your opinion based on your choosen relgious beliefs, both which you have a right to have and express thanks to the 'evil' Freemasons." And then try to leave it at that. If they try to persist, I add, "I'm sorry, I'm not willing to discuss this any further. Since I am not Jesus, I so not have the power to make a blindman see."

I had one try to keep arguing after that. He came back with calling me the blindman, to which I responded, "So you think you are Jesus and can make a blindman see? That's blastphemy." It just got worse for him from there. Some people just don't know how to quit while they are behind.
 

coachn

Coach John S. Nagy
Premium Member
...the reason for us not actively defending the fraternity is because those who choose to talk negatively about us would of course ask for "proof" that their accusations are false. And part of providing this "proof" would be to disclose our secrets to those who have not earned the right to our knowledge which we have earned as freemasons. ...
My experience of Naysons and my understanding of them tells me that there exists not one Masonic Secret that could or would ever be considered "proof" of anything to Naysons, other than what they could twist it into to prove what they have already concluded.
 

jwardl

Registered User
During table talk, what do you say to an Anti Freemason when he says things about it, such as it's a cult, devil lovers and wants to rule the world, etc...? But yet, he still doesn't know you are or even if you are.

The Anti-Mason is a conspiracy nut, and "needs" to be smarter and more informed than those around him to feel significant. Arguing with him is pointless.

Just smile, try not to roll your eyes too much, and see how he reacts if he notices your masonic ring, keychain, etc. :38:
 
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