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Question about courtesy work from State to State

VinnyC

Registered User
How does "courtesy" work from different Lodges from other states work if the proficiency test exams are or could be different from the persons home state? For example, a brother needed to take the proficiency test for FC but things came up and he had to move. He memorized what he needed for Texas but when he moved to "whatever state", the memorization answers and questions were different, because the "whatever state" uses different words or ways for the exam.
Would he need to redo the whole FC memorization/obligations/lectures and what-not?
Does this make any sense???? LOL
Just wondering.
Thanks
-Vinny
 
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dhouseholder

Registered User
Being from state to state, the respective Grand Lodges would have to get involved on this one. I bet it would be GM's discretion.

I bet you could work something out over the phone. But yeah, this is a tough question. Have you asked your DDGM?
 

BroBill

Site Benefactor
Site Benefactor
The letter requesting the work would go from your seretary to your GL, the your GL to the state GL where the work is to be done, then that GL to the lodge that will do the work.

I believe that's the process and it should be fairly routine, just allow time for the correspondence.

If any brother spots something in error or that I've omitted, please feel free to correct; good info is my intention and desire....
 

Spring TX MM

Premium Member
Wouldn't the time for the next proficiency already be expired after the process?

Depends on the state(jurisdiction). Bro Bill said it correctly as far as I'm aware. One option may be to schedule a proficiency with your home lodge, then travel back for the turn-in. I've seen this happen before. This way you can turn in the work you already know. After the proficiency, you can have the secretary of the prospective lodge, file for a waiver of jurisdiction with your home lodge and GL so you can have your next Degree/Degrees performed by the lodge closest to where you live now. I would have to look up waiver of jurisdiction to see how it applies with other states(jurisdictions).

Timelines expiring shouldn't worry you. They're just a formality. Some paperwork required depending on how long expired and depending on state(jurisdiction). Its my opinion that we have the time constraints simply to act as a goal. If we don't set a goal, we tend not to complete things. Well, maybe not always but goals/timelines work best for me. Hope this helps you find your way.

If I spoke in error, anyone feel free to correct me as well.

S&F,
Kyle
 

California Master

Registered User
Brother Bill and Worshipful Master Kyle are right. It becomes a Grand Lodge issue that must be done between both Grand Lodges. Waivers of jurisdictions and timeliness would be taken care of with them. I agree that if possible, the candidate should try to attend a lodge in his home state to turn in the proficiency. If that is logistically not possible, then the candidate might have to get a coach to help him with the new state's work. I have never encountered that issue. I have had courtesy degrees within the same state. IE: Someone moving from Sacramento, CA to my area. We do courtesy degrees for his home lodge with the consent of both lodges and their respective Inspectors (DDGM). However, the ritual and memory work is still the same.
 

Bill Lins

Moderating Staff
Staff Member
Does this make any sense????

Absolutely- yours is an excellent question. While there are recognizable differences in ritual between some of the various jurisdictions, I doubt that any of them are such that a traveling Brother would (or should) be denied the privileges of Masonry. While the Grand Secretaries would need to be involved, I doubt the Brother would be required to relearn and resubmit everything. Besides, if he learned Texas work, he already has the "correct" ritual. :wink:
 

Michaelstedman81

Premium Member
Wouldn't the time for the next proficiency already be expired after the process?

Bro. Vinny, overall, I really don't think that you are going to have any kind of issues when you PCS. The area that you are going to is kind of the same as where you are now when it comes to a lot of the Masons in the area being military or prior service. Some of them will most likely have experience in transferring membership themselves, and some might even have PCSed while in the middle of taking the degrees. The biggest is issue, which really isn't too much of an issue, is that it will take a little bit more time because it all is going to have to go through both GLs. Just make sure that you stay in constant contact with BOTH lodge Secretarys to keep getting SITREPs from both ends if you haven't heard anything new. Take your EA (or FC if you are FC now) card with you, and you should be allowed to sit in lodge and practices with them (up to whatever degree you are, of course). I have even seen one Brother who proved that he was a Brother from another state/jurisdiction was allowed to go ahead and start working on his work with the local lodge while all the paperwork was in motion and waiting on the GLs to conduct their business.

All in all, don't worry about the time "expiring" too much. Worst case, it does exprire and you have to go through whatever necessary paperwork to advance. You being Active Duty, especially with all the field time and PCSing, I don't really know of a lodge or GL that wouldn't allow you to continue you.

Besides, if he learned Texas work, he already has the "correct" ritual. :wink:

Hahah now that is funny right there...lol
 

cemab4y

Premium Member
I belong to a lodge in a college town. We often perform courtesy work on individuals from other lodges. Most all of them, are from lodges which are in our own state, and therefore there is no difference in ritual or proficiency.

When there are multiple Grand Lodges involved, it can get more complicated. The lodge which actually performs the degree work, is responsible to ensure that the candidate is instructed properly, and if there is a proficiency, the performing lodge is responsible for that too.

With our increasingly mobile society, there will be more instances where courtesy work is required.
 
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