Are Mason's allowed to lie

Discussion in 'General Freemasonry Discussion' started by jvarnell, Sep 24, 2012.

  1. jvarnell

    jvarnell Premium Member

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    Are Mason's allowed to lie for any reasion? As I have been resurching for some of my thoughts in other threads I cam across the concept of "Taquia" which looks like a concept of lieing for certian out comes.


    And it looks like so-called Peace is one of the three reasions.
     
  2. JustinScott

    JustinScott Premium Member

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    I say yes if the truth is to much for someone to handle and it will cause problems it is better for them not to know
     
  3. Tony Uzzell

    Tony Uzzell Registered User

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    Allowed to? Yes.

    Encouraged to? No.

    A Mason is encouraged to live a moral life. Does that mean he should never lie? That's like asking if any "good man" should ever lie. Is it okay to tell your wife, "Of course that skirt doesn't make your butt look big."? Is it okay to tell your elderly mother, "No, Mom, that hat doesn't look silly....not even with those extra flowers on it."?

    Are "little white lies" okay while big whoppers about not seeing the guy who did the shooting while being questioned by the police not okay?

    It's really a very complex question that's a lot bigger than "Are Masons allowed to lie?".

    TU
     
  4. JustinScott

    JustinScott Premium Member

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    Agreed
     
  5. JJones

    JJones Moderator Staff Member

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    Agreed, it isn't a question of what you're allowed to do.

    Tell the next woman that asks your opinion the truth and then you can come back and answer your own question. :p
     
  6. jvarnell

    jvarnell Premium Member

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    Did anyone look up the word "Taquia" for context? To me a lie is intintanal misouse of the trouth for gain.
     
  7. jvarnell

    jvarnell Premium Member

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    please lookup "Taquia" and see how you feel after that.
     
  8. Pscyclepath

    Pscyclepath Premium Member

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    The best guideline: refer to the ties in your obligations. What did you promise to do, or not do?

    (Note: something you ought to answer to yourself... not post back here!)
     
    Last edited: Sep 24, 2012
  9. Plustax

    Plustax Registered User

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    It's Taqiyya.

    Sounds like "pot stirring" time.

     
  10. jvarnell

    jvarnell Premium Member

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    Thanks this gave me a lot more info to read. A friend living in the mid-east told me to look this up in conjunction with lieing. So I thought I would pose it to y'all.
     
  11. jvarnell

    jvarnell Premium Member

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    How do I know what questions are off limits here if I don't ask them? And I do know what it is in the obligation but wanted to figure out how others felt.
     
  12. Pscyclepath

    Pscyclepath Premium Member

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    Not intending to jump on you there... but some questions in Freemasonry are best answered by serching within your own heart... e.g., just what does your obligation(s) mean to _you_, personally? Based on the light you've received so far, what do you think about the issue? And some things like this are often best answered over a cold Coke or cup of coffee, around the table in the lodge hall... For you will not find Freemasonry within books, or out here on the internet. You find it in the hearts and acts of your brothers, and ultimately within your own. Faced with a certain situation, how are you going to employ your working tools and trestle board to deal with it?

    (The ties in the obligations are esoteric, though, and not proper to be written in places like this... hence the caution)
     
  13. chrmc

    chrmc Registered User

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    By using common sense. This post, as many of your recent ones, have a clear negative view on the Islam faith. Personally I don't know what your issue with it is, but I've stopped reading and responding to the threads where you are sharing your views.
    This is a masonic website. If you want to discuss masonry and Islam I'm sure that many people will participate. If you just want to find a reason to perpetuate that Islam is a "bad religion" I'm not going to participate.

    Remember your obligation and why you hopefully joined the fraternity. To make yourself a better man. I would say that tolerance should play a part some where in there.
     
  14. dhouseholder

    dhouseholder Registered User

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    Its called "lying to save your rear". Taqiyya is that concept precisely. In some parts of the world, exposing your beliefs can be very harmful to one's health. I see absolutely no problem in bald-faced lying if it saves my life, or those of loved ones.
     
    Last edited: Sep 24, 2012
  15. daddyrich

    daddyrich Registered User

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    Pot-stirring, indeed. Dude, we get it - you either do not like and/or do not trust Muslims. Maybe there should be a thread titled "Reasons why My Religion/or God is better than yours". Again, you have BROTHERS who are devout Muslims and it doesn't interfere with their sincerity to the Craft. But if I were one of them, I'd worry about the sincerity of some of my "brothers".
     
  16. jvarnell

    jvarnell Premium Member

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    Well I did not mean to stir the pot where it sloshed into the beans, but I did want to reconcile the deferances of what I have learned as a Masion all the religions/dogma of the earth. I am here to put out my hand and help a brother in need. I just want to know when I do it will be excepted and given without strings.
     
  17. dhouseholder

    dhouseholder Registered User

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    I am not the Grand Master, but I am pretty sure I speak for 99% of all Masons when I say "if you have to lie to save your life, you will not be brought up on Masonic charges".
     
  18. widows son

    widows son Premium Member

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    Everyone lies and will lie many times in your life, pscyclepath makes a great point about masonry. Jvarnell if not telling the truth to someone because it might hurt them is not the right answer, if you lie you can be preventing them from bettering themselves, or knowing something that change a situation for the better in their life. Lying usually occurs when your ashamed or afraid of telling the truth. As for our obligations and I've been question by certain people on this forum on this subject and here is my answer: it's none of your business. Our obligations we took are personal and sacred to the individual. We agreed not to betray eachother as brothers and our order. As far as anti Muslim, there's no need for it, they are people who are flawed just like you. Nobody has the right to judge others, we all breathe oxygen and have red blood coursing through our veins
     
  19. T.N. Sampson

    T.N. Sampson Guest

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    Gentlemen:
    How does this fit into the discussion:
    I think the words 'endeavor' and 'influenced' are key to understanding the tenet. Also worth contemplating is the last phrase, which points out that truth among Masons is paramount.

    Actually we do, as civil, criminal and Masonic trials make clear. There are many bases upon which judgment occurs, and we all have to know what basis our judgment rests upon before we can claim a proper judgment. Cordially, Skip.
     
  20. widows son

    widows son Premium Member

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    Skip your not at mason so how can you speak as one? An what gives you the right to judge anyone? You have no right judging people, but again your religious conviction probably tells you otherwise
     

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