Far-right religious group behind outrageous health care lies

Discussion in 'The Refreshment Lounge' started by Blake Bowden, Aug 12, 2009.

  1. Blake Bowden

    Blake Bowden Administrator Staff Member

    5,679
    984
    113
  2. JBD

    JBD Premium Member

    311
    3
    0
    And the point of this post from one of the most left leaning websites on earth while they hammer a right leaning group?

    The information is still correct, and the President confirmed it in his own words on tape

    Nevertheless, the purpose in posting this was what exactly?
     
  3. Sirius

    Sirius Registered User

    580
    8
    0
    I must say that I am terrified that the government is going to force my grandmother to have an abortion and then not pay for it.

    but seriously, whats so bad about a living will or a 'directive to doctor' in case of an emergency? I damn sure don't want my body kept alive for 15 years because nobody knows what I want. If my brain is dead and my body cant run on its own, let me die. Whats wrong with this? I still don't get it. Many insurance policies cover this type of planning. How is this a 'death panel'?
     
  4. Blake Bowden

    Blake Bowden Administrator Staff Member

    5,679
    984
    113
    Look above..."Off Topic A place for everything else"
     
  5. JBD

    JBD Premium Member

    311
    3
    0
    Yes I can read, where is not the answer to why though -
     
  6. Blake Bowden

    Blake Bowden Administrator Staff Member

    5,679
    984
    113
    You're not going to question every post in the Off Topic area are you? :rolleyes: I often post articles from the left and right as we need to see both sides of the issue. With the unfulfilled promises by the left and the scare tactics from right, we have to navigate through the crap and try to find a glimmer of truth. If our only source of news is Rush Limbaugh or the Huffington Post, we'll be in bad shape.
     
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2009
  7. Sirius

    Sirius Registered User

    580
    8
    0
    And terrified!
     
  8. TCShelton

    TCShelton Founding Member Premium Member

    1,037
    8
    38
    That he does. I can vouch for that.
     
  9. JBD

    JBD Premium Member

    311
    3
    0

    No as a matter of fact I am not, just everyone that I find necessary to respond to - especially this one.

    Tom you can testify to that as well I suspect :D
     
  10. Wingnut

    Wingnut Premium Member

    1,095
    17
    38
    Let me ask all here... has ANYONE read the bill yet? all 1k+ pages? There is some scary stuff in there! The fact that most politicians have not and will not read it is really scary! Obama admits to having not read it as have most congresscritters...
     
  11. Sirius

    Sirius Registered User

    580
    8
    0
    there are 5 bills in the House and 1 in the Senate, to which do you refer? Which did you read?
     
  12. Wingnut

    Wingnut Premium Member

    1,095
    17
    38
    only 1 has made it out of committee in either
     
  13. JTM

    JTM "Just in case" Premium Member

    2,353
    25
    38
    take a side in your original post, or comment about it so that i can reply.

    otherwise i'm bound to say, "Daily KOS is liberal hippy crap"

    they spend more than half of the article debunking the people, and then half ass their rebuttal. i'm not impressed in the least.
     
  14. Blake Bowden

    Blake Bowden Administrator Staff Member

    5,679
    984
    113
    Does that make the article illegitimate? Why aren't we discussing the facts they presented?
     
  15. JTM

    JTM "Just in case" Premium Member

    2,353
    25
    38
    i'd ask the same of them. i'm criticizing their article.
     
  16. Wingnut

    Wingnut Premium Member

    1,095
    17
    38
    Do NOT confuse the issue with the facts!
     
  17. owls84

    owls84 Moderator Premium Member

    1,653
    9
    38
    I'm confussed... I really am. What are we debating here? This thread has jumped 3 times and pissed a few people off? I mean really. If we say no to the dang thing do you honestly think it can stop it from going through? I am all for writing and calling a congressman and have on several occasions, but do you think that once they got the letter? They are going by what they get a bigger kick back on. I know I can't compete with a pharmacutical company or a heathcare provider.

    I want each and every one of you to sit and think about your local government and then the state. At what point does it get corrupt? What is a plan of action here? Sure we can complain all we want but the truth is WE ALL just benifitted from something we wanted being tacked on and slid under the door of Congress. HB2555 for the property tax. Why else would do you think that GM did not want us to call our congress members? Plus just as he stated and I heard him there is more to come on this. He is still working the system.

    So I ask why is it ok sometimes and not ok others? There is not one person on this forum that can tell me that the healthcare system in the USA is right and does not need to be fixed. Does it need to be left up to the States? Maybe, but Perry has had his chance to fix it and he hasn't done squat. Now that its an election year and he has to show his face he just now decided to bring up the topic. I'm sorry but I am not sure that the plan on the floor is the best plan but something has to change period. Heathcare companies have too much power over us as a middleclass and it needs to stop.

    Note: I am not for or against this. Actually from everything I have seen I would fall under the same thing as the President or Congress themselves and not be using a sysyem like this since I work at Lockheed and we have our insurance negotiated in our union contracts. The only way I would be effected would be a tax increase and even if it is $10 a week and the way I look at is if a I can help insure more children in America then I don't care about the $520. JMHO
     
  18. Sirius

    Sirius Registered User

    580
    8
    0
    :) Very reasonable.
     
  19. Wingnut

    Wingnut Premium Member

    1,095
    17
    38
    I didnt realize people were pissed...

    at the local level. It takes much less money to influence a small town mayor than a congresscritter. For that matter a city councilman. witness whats going on in Dallas right now...

    Agreed, I had concerns at the time this came up. Didnt seem to be on the level as it were

    It shouldnt be. Its a political reality but it shouldnt be.


    fixing yes, overhauled to the point of the government running it? no! Id rather keep what I have, which if you make any change at all, any change to your current policy its out the window and your stuck with the ghubment plan. If the federal government wants to fix healthcare, lets start with fixing medicare and medicaid! Its already bankrupting the country and is filled with corruption. Baby steps would be better fix whats there first, then move to improving it by adding more to it.


    Healthcare insurance companies have a 3.5% profit margine. Fertilizer companies have around a 15% profit margine! Ive seen military health care, the VA, medicare etc. FAIL! How well do you think a bureaucracy in DC will manage health care? Honestly? There goal will be to minimize direct costs and will have more layers than a 1015 onion. By direct costs I mean the cost for medical treatment. With the headcount they will add at every layer the costs to the taxpayer will be HUGE.

    Every country in the world that has government run medicine has a much higher cancer rate, lower cancer survival rate. One example I saw online was talking about how long it takes to get in to get an MRI done in England... 8 months is about normal. Here? I can get in tomorrow or even today.

    One person mentioned that the US has a better medical infrastructure than the other countries do. I wonder why? US has something like 1 MRI for every 300 people. UK its more like 3000. Why? Doctors and hospitals bought them. The government doesnt want to put out the money for them. With few exceptions, very few new innovations in surgery, medicine and equipment comes from any other country but the US... I wonder why? Making money is a huge incentive. If there is no profit in it most wont spend the money to research it or develop it. I seriously doubt the government will invest the time and money into and if they do the money has to come from somewhere to pay for it.

    In order to fix the problem we need to define the problem. Honest open discussions. Not using inflated numbers of how many dont have insurance. Example, I asked my congressman if I was included as part of the uninsured. After all I dont have my companies insurance, I turned down the military retiree insurance so thats 2 reports I show up on as uninsured. Wait! Im on my wifes policy at CVS because its a better policy than the government policy via the military or the AT&T policy... the answer was yea Im getting counted twice as uninsured. Illegal aliens are being counted as part of the uninsured. Opps just ran into the points of a compasses!
     
  20. Sirius

    Sirius Registered User

    580
    8
    0
    While I disagree on some points I must say that I always enjoy hearing an informed opinion, even if I disagree.

    For rebuttal, the proposal includes things that will bring costs down and reign in waste in medicare/caid. Most importantly the government isn't going to 'take over' health care, just provide an option. That being said, the need for it can be debated.

    Health care costs have doubled in 10 years, if we're really worried about debt, this should be everyone's priority.
     

Share My Freemasonry