Separate But Equal?

[Blake Bowden]

In Texas, we recognize the Most Worshipful Grand Lodge of Texas and the Most Worshipful Prince Hall Grand Lodge of Texas as equals.

That being said, every day we receive dozens of messages from those seeking membership. Where do we lead them? Prince Hall is predominately African-American and if you know PHA history, you'll understand why. Mainstream (I hate that term) Freemasonry, had a history of bigotry and racism but is slowly becoming more diverse.

Is profiling okay in Freemasonry? If an individual is African American, should we automatically point him towards PHA simply because of his skin color? Would he feel more at home? If a white guy asked for guidance should we automatically send him to a "mainstream" Lodge?

For me, the existence of two Grand Lodges under one jurisdiction is a contradiction. I understand why they both exist, but it sucks. Your thoughts?

 

[Elexir]

As a sidenote: In Denmark three diffrent masonic orders with different rituals are under 1 GL.

 

[goomba]

Working and living in the DC gets even more complicated, DC, MD, and VA that's six grand lodges. Generally if they live in Maryland, the state I live in, I'll direct them to the my grand lodges website and help them find a lodge close to them. I've had one person ask about PHA and I showed him their website as well. In Maryland the lodges and Masons I've seen "mainstream" has a great mix and no one should feel out of place. On the flip side I would expect a Prince Hall Mason to refer any person to their grand lodge website unless asked otherwise. It's not that I think one is better than the other we each individually know our lodge and grand lodge.

 

[coachn]

In Texas, we recognize the Most Worshipful Grand Lodge of Texas and the Most Worshipful Prince Hall Grand Lodge of Texas as equals.

That being said, every day we receive dozens of messages from those seeking membership.

Who is this "we" to which you refer?

Where do we lead them?

Why not have a series of open ended questions that lets you know what they are seeking specifically?

Prince Hall is predominately African-American and if you know PHA history, you'll understand why. Mainstream (I hate that term) Freemasonry, had a history of bigotry and racism but is slowly becoming more diverse.

Is profiling okay in Freemasonry?

Of course it is. However, you're not writing out the true question: is RACIAL profiling okay?

And the answer to that is a no brainer.

If an individual is African American, should we automatically point him towards PHA simply because of his skin color?

Of course not. It's not about what we assume about a person's interests. It's about what they are looking for that we should be most interested.

Would he feel more at home?

Again, what is HE looking for?

If a white guy asked for guidance should we automatically send him to a "mainstream" Lodge?

No Way! I know many Brothers who think of themselves as "white" who want what PHA is offering.

For me, the existence of two Grand Lodges under one jurisdiction is a contradiction. I understand why they both exist, but it sucks. Your thoughts?

It only sucks if you believe there is both a conflict and a contradiction. I do not believe these exist anywhere other than in the hearts and minds of those who don't understand the true reason for grand lodges, and they are not to rule and govern over any territory or the lodges within that territory. They exist to support lodges and to assure there is consistency. Unfortunately, they have been given far too much power and in doing so, they have cut off their lodges from their collective manhoods.

 

[SimonM]

It's not about what we assume about a person's interests. It's about what they are looking for that we should be most interested.

This is really interesting, how would do you describe the differences for a potential candidate to help him find what he searches for? I have never set foot in any american lodge, and have only a vague notion of the differences between PHA and "mainstream" so I couldn't do it.

 

[MRichard]

I don't refer to any grand lodge as mainstream. I use state grand lodges or my grand lodge and then PHA cause they are the regular and/or recognized grand lodges in the US. I would advise someone interested in his options and explain the differences between the grand lodges so that he can make an informed choice for himself.

 

[CLewey44]

I think Bro Blake is really asking, why is this even the situation still in the 21st century? PHA was brought about out of necessity of those horrible times in America when black men and white men were separated due to a skin pigmentation difference. I really wish we were all under one GL and maybe PHA be an appendant body perhaps. I don't want it to go away because it has such a rich history. I simply want them to merge. Let masons be masons. I don't foresee that happening because it's such a deep tradition. Even though it has no intentions of seeming a little Jim Crowish, it simply does scream 'separate but equal'.

 

[MRichard]

I think Bro Blake is really asking, why is this even the situation still in the 21st century? PHA was brought about out of necessity of those horrible times in America when black men and white men were separated due to a skin pigmentation difference. I really wish we were all under one GL and maybe PHA be an appendant body perhaps. I don't want it to go away because it has such a rich history. I simply want them to merge. Let masons be masons. I don't foresee that happening because it's such a deep tradition. Even though it has no intentions of seeming a little Jim Crowish, it simply does scream 'separate but equal'.

There is really no need to merge and who would want to merge to become an appendant body? Dual and plural memberships for both grand lodges is what I would advocate. There are multiple grand lodges in practically every state. Although I see people on both sides supporting it.

 

[CLewey44]

I meant all blue lodges merge into one GL instead of two. PHA could be an appendant/concordant body to not lose that legacy. I don't know, it just seems a little too 1805 or 1960s in the south to me and a lot of people. It is almost primarily in the U.S. that the PHA and non-PHA standard is going on and it shouldn't be necessary anymore. If any racists on either side didn't like it, then they'd probably be culled out pretty quick and no longer apart of this fraternity. It's an unnecessary divide in my opinion.

 

[MRichard]

I meant all blue lodges merge into one GL instead of two. PHA could be an appendant/concordant body to not lose that legacy. I don't know, it just seems a little too 1805 or 1960s in the south to me and a lot of people. It is almost primarily in the U.S. that the PHA and non-PHA standard is going on and it shouldn't be necessary anymore. If any racists on either side didn't like it, then they'd probably be culled out pretty quick and no longer apart of this fraternity. It's an unnecessary divide in my opinion.

I know what you meant. Just don't think that's the best path but I respect your opinion.

I live in the South. Dealing with some of these issues will take decades.

If you just told the racists to leave if they don't like it out here, I don't even want to speculate what would happen.

 

[Bloke]

I meant all blue lodges merge into one GL instead of two. PHA could be an appendant/concordant body to not lose that legacy. I don't know, it just seems a little too 1805 or 1960s in the south to me and a lot of people. It is almost primarily in the U.S. that the PHA and non-PHA standard is going on and it shouldn't be necessary anymore. If any racists on either side didn't like it, then they'd probably be culled out pretty quick and no longer apart of this fraternity. It's an unnecessary divide in my opinion.

Sounds like a good idea.. but why doesnt GL TX become and appendant body of the PH GL in TX ? Does that still sounds like a good idea ??

I think the relationship need to normalise as one between two Soverign GLs - interventionist policed by lodges at their West Gate. Perhaps the current onerous system arose because GL TX became aware there were subordinate lodges which would block their West Gate? It's either that or the GLs are control freaks or taking a tiny baby step.. lets hope baby steps soon move to strides...

 

[Glen Cook]

I think Bro Blake is really asking, why is this even the situation still in the 21st century? PHA was brought about out of necessity of those horrible times in America when black men and white men were separated due to a skin pigmentation difference. I really wish we were all under one GL and maybe PHA be an appendant body perhaps. I don't want it to go away because it has such a rich history. I simply want them to merge. Let masons be masons. I don't foresee that happening because it's such a deep tradition. Even though it has no intentions of seeming a little Jim Crowish, it simply does scream 'separate but equal'.

PHA an appendant body? Thus giving up its sovereignty?

In most jurisdictions, the brothers of colour would again be a minority in their craft. I'm only a religious minority and haven't faced bigotry since last night.

The PHA lodges with which I'm familiar have a close relationship with the African American churches. I'm afraid the SGLs have lost that Church connection.

We have jurisdictions which are shared amongst the Home GLs and a national GL. It's the respect for the other GLs that is the key. The distinctions are maintained with amity.

 

[MRichard]

The PHA lodges with which I'm familiar have a close relationship with the African American churches. I'm afraid the SGLs have lost that Church connection.

Some would argue too close. Blurred lines.

 

[Glen Cook]

Some would argue too close. Blurred lines.

Umm, yeah. I have seen some posts where the Laying on of Hands was performed at a Masonic meeting.

 

[CLewey44]

Sounds like a good idea.. but why doesnt GL TX become and appendant body of the PH GL in TX ? Does that still sounds like a good idea ??

In this regard I would simply say non-PHA masonry had been around longer. It's not a competition but masonry has been around before 1784. I know the point is moot.

 

[MRichard]

Umm, yeah. I have seen some posts where the Laying on of Hands was performed at a Masonic meeting.

I saw the same posts. PHTT

 

[Dontrell Stroman]

Can someone answer what the difference between PHA and State GL is ? I guess im a little lost. I thought both practiced the same freemasonry. Is anything different ?

Sent from my LG-LS997 using My Freemasonry mobile app

 

[Dontrell Stroman]

In Texas, we recognize the Most Worshipful Grand Lodge of Texas and the Most Worshipful Prince Hall Grand Lodge of Texas as equals.

That being said, every day we receive dozens of messages from those seeking membership. Where do we lead them? Prince Hall is predominately African-American and if you know PHA history, you'll understand why. Mainstream (I hate that term) Freemasonry, had a history of bigotry and racism but is slowly becoming more diverse.

Is profiling okay in Freemasonry? If an individual is African American, should we automatically point him towards PHA simply because of his skin color? Would he feel more at home? If a white guy asked for guidance should we automatically send him to a "mainstream" Lodge?

For me, the existence of two Grand Lodges under one jurisdiction is a contradiction. I understand why they both exist, but it sucks. Your thoughts?

Thank you for your concern on a divided brotherhood. I share the same thoughts amd concerns.

 

[MRichard]

Can someone answer what the difference between PHA and State GL is ? I guess im a little lost. I thought both practiced the same freemasonry. Is anything different ?

Sent from my LG-LS997 using My Freemasonry mobile app

Don't start.

 

[Dontrell Stroman]

Don't start.

Im being serious. Other than maybe culture, what is the difference? I have always said masonry is masonry (Meaning regular lodges)