The Holy Saints Johns

Discussion in 'General Freemasonry Discussion' started by JustinScott, Dec 27, 2012.

  1. JustinScott

    JustinScott Premium Member

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    In the lecture of my EA degree they touched up on this aspect of masonic education but never gave a direct full explanation of who they are and what their significance is; it must be important to understand them due to their recurring theme.
     
  2. crono782

    crono782 Premium Member

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    Last edited: Dec 27, 2012
  3. KSigMason

    KSigMason Traveling Templar Site Benefactor

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  4. THurse

    THurse Premium Member

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    I myself Brother,what I do not know,. I research and study. Their are different opinions, but take the best out of what you learn Brother. Happy New Years.
     
  5. cog41

    cog41 Premium Member

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    Last edited: Dec 31, 2012
  6. scialytic

    scialytic Premium Member

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    My recent research for a paper I am trying to write shows that in medieval times in Europe (England is my current focus) the Catholic Church was the major influence for the operative Masons. During the building of the Gothic Cathedrals, the Church pretty much ran the show and that was the reason for Patron Saints of the Guild. There are many other carry-overs from that era just before the wave of speculative Masons, and it appears that the Patron Saints stuck.

    I didn't look at the other link listed, so I don't know if they are similar or different, but this has been from my independent research for another project.
     
  7. widows son

    widows son Premium Member

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    That's quite interesting.
     
  8. scialytic

    scialytic Premium Member

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    Yeah, before King Henry VIII split from the Church, all of England was governed by State Law, Canon Law, and the Ordinances of Religion. Nearly all Christian operative Masons in England would have been "officially" members of the Catholic Church and all Guild activities would have certain required ceremonies, rituals, and elements present in the Lodge for it to operate legally. If this is accurate, it actually explains a lot of the "religious-like" aspects of our current Craft, because at one point they were present and required (at least for operative Lodges before the first Speculative Grand Lodges after 1717). I'm part way through writing a research paper that incorporates this research. I'm pretty excited about it.
     
  9. scialytic

    scialytic Premium Member

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    Another interesting explanation comes from Jewel P. Lightfoot's, "Lightfoot's Commentaries." He purports that St John the Baptist had the second Temple dedicated to him and that St John the Evangelist was initiated into Masonry at an early age and was asked to be Grand Master, but he could not because he was over 90 and very ill. There isn't any reference to source documents or much substance for these assertions, but they are there...

    (Jewel P. Lightfoot is PGM of Texas Freemasons and the main editor/compiler of the Monitor that Texas has used for over 50 years. He was an amazing Brother!)
     
  10. jwhoff

    jwhoff Premium Member

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    I believe you found that Anderson's change in the written constitution from the religion of the country of residence to that religion agreed to by all good men of faith created a stir in the lodges of the time. Many refused to join the fraternity (some even opting to go clandestine) for some time before accepting the constitution.

    This had as much to do with the politics of the time as religion.

    WHERE HAVE I HEARD THIS TOXIC COMBINATION BEFORE
    !
     
  11. widows son

    widows son Premium Member

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    One thing I must say is when we hear ancient figures "being initiated into masonry" and were grand masters, we need to remember the allegorical nature of the statement. Freemasonry embodies the principles and values that was prevalent in the past, especially in the mystery institutions. When we hear a prominent figure in the bible was grand master, we have to realize that he is living out the ideals that we have established today through those specific traditions of the past, which characterizes freemasonry. It is quite easy to see the similarities between the secrecy of the mystery schools and the secrecy of the stonemasons guild, and how they marry each other.
     
  12. brothermongelli

    brothermongelli Registered User

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    Look into "neheh." I'll say no more! :cool:
     
  13. widows son

    widows son Premium Member

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