American (or even Texan) Freemasonry is Christian?

Discussion in 'General Freemasonry Discussion' started by ctp2nd, Nov 25, 2009.

  1. TCShelton

    TCShelton Founding Member Premium Member

    That I agree with, since practically every "Christian" element or concept is older than Chritianity itself and can be found in older, mostly defunct religions.
  2. Sam Whitley

    Sam Whitley Registered User

    Brothers, I did not perhaps expand on some things I said. Three Distinct Knocks was an early "explanation" or exposee of Masonry written in 1760 (not 1750 as I originally posted). A copy of this book is available on the Pietre-Stones Review of Freemasonry website on the internet. In the scanned version of that book (PDF form) on page 8 (of 40 pages... maybe just Chapter 1 about the EA Degree), are the following words near the end of the introductory prayer for the EA (we have significantly changed and much shortened this prayer) in the last paragraph of the prayer:

    "... through our Lord Jesus Christ, who liveth and reigneth for ever and ever. Amen.

    Master: After you have received this prayer, what was said to you?

    Answer: I was asked who I put my trust in. ..."

    To me, that part of the prayer indicates that Christianity was an integral part of the EA Degree in 1760. Maybe I misread or misinterpreted those words, but I don't believe so.

    The Lord's Prayer was offered in the New Testament by Jesus as the perfect example of "how to pray." The Lord in this context is thus IMO "God, the Father." This, though Christians generally (universally?) believe in the Trinity which obviously includes Jesus. I don't remember it showing up in the Old Testament anywhere.

    I base my belief of the Christian ties to Masonry primarily on this early writing in Three Distinct Knocks. This book could be a hoax, but I do not believe so. It would explain a lot of things that otherwise defy understanding and logic.
  3. TCShelton

    TCShelton Founding Member Premium Member

    Lol, I thought that was what you said. Pay attention, Rhit.. !:7:
  4. owls84

    owls84 Moderator Premium Member

    IMHO, I think the Masons make Christianity a part of Masonry. The work in TX Masonry has changed many times through out history. It is the same way you open the Bible in a way and it seems crazy how just where you opened it speaks to your situation you are currently in. I am willing to bet it speaks the same to Muslims, Jewish people, etc.

    As far as the 1760 comments, I thought "Modern" Masonry dates to 1717 and actually before that in some records, making this another spin on it. As I see it, it could be just like if Resolution #9 passes if someone is raised after this, as they know it the Tradition through antiquity is it is a Christian based organization, but the fact is that Masons changed it to make it that way. The way I see it is the "word" of Masonry could be lost forever. We may never know when that first Lodge met or the book that was on that alter, if any. It does make my mind wonder.
  5. rhitland

    rhitland Founding Member Premium Member

    It was early when I read that. I will check the book out most def. sounds very interesting. Thanks for the clarification Brother and sorry for the misinterp.
  6. drapetomaniac

    drapetomaniac Premium Member Premium Member

    The Regius Poem (year 1390) refers to "lord" but it seems more a reference to class and station in context:
    MASONIC DOCUMENT - The Regius Poem ( Halliwell MS ) c.1390

    It also makes a strong and specific point of drawing on Euclid and Euclid's time in Egypt. I'm not sure Euclid was considered a Christian..

    Freemasonry might "have Christian origins" but that's like saying the Mayflower was a Christian ship, or the British Parliament has Christian origins. Hurricane comes from the name of a Taino god. I'm sure there are religious ceremonies and celebrations around corn - so we could call it a pagan food.

    But those are all de facto. Other religions were utterly wiped out in Europe, so it was as default a religion as indigenous religions pre-conquest by various groups.

    However, there are organizations that were Christian in origin and intent and mission - and I guarantee you can tell those apart from freemasonry (which cites a pagan greek, and a pagan science ;-).
  7. C_Cabra

    C_Cabra Registered User

    In the ritual that we practice today in Texas I see nothing remotely Christian. The religious elements that are included in our ritual are common to both Christianity, Islam, and Judaism and come from the old testament.

    If the question were "American (or even Texan) Freemasonry is Judaic?" I think you might have an arguement.

    The only parts of Masonic ritual that mention religion aren't even "Christian" because they predate Christ and are only so associated because Christians study the old testament.

    Remove the Bible containing the new testament from the Altar and replace it with the Quran and suddenly there is nothing even remotely Christian in the Lodge Room aside from individual members.

    Texas Freemasonry seems "Christian" because of the membership not the ritual.
  8. cemab4y

    cemab4y Premium Member

    USA Freemasonry is definetly NOT Christian. Men of many different faith backgrounds and traditions participate in our quiet retreat. I have attended lodge with Jewish men, and with Muslim men. In Washington DC, I once assisted a man in taking his Fellow Craft oath on the Holy Qu'Ran (The sacred text of Islam). I consider this one of the high points of my masonic experience. I wish more Muslims would join Freemasonry.

    I attended lodges in Saudi Arabia, where the Holy Bible and the Holy Qu'Ran were side by side on the altar.

    Masonry accepts men who believe in God. The individual belief systems of the individual man are of no concern to Masonry. We are truly a non-denominational, non-sectarian, inter-faith organization. I am proud to participate in a fraternity that welcomes men from such a wide rainbow of faiths.

    Here is a portion of a letter written by Brother George Washington, to the Jewish congregation at Truro Synagogue:

    The Citizens of the United States of America have a right to applaud themselves for giving to Mankind examples of an enlarged and liberal policy: a policy worthy of imitation. All possess alike liberty of conscience and immunities of citizenship. It is now no more that toleration is spoken of, as if it was by the indulgence of one class of people that another enjoyed the exercise of their inherent natural rights. For happily the Government of the United States, which gives to bigotry no sanction, to persecution no assistance, requires only that they who live under its protection, should demean themselves as good citizens.
  9. drapetomaniac

    drapetomaniac Premium Member Premium Member

    I was reading The Builders last night.
    THE BUILDERS by JOSEPH FORT NEWTON - A masonic book online

    The chapter "Drama of Faith" had more relevance to other religions than I had ever expected. That said, I'm also looking for other versions of the same story to see if they jibe. If they do, its very directly not Christian.

    As a life long Christian, I don't think the principles of working on oneself in the masonic context falls into how most of Christianity is taught (being ignorant of the eastern orthodox to some degree.) Most of the focus is on faith, belief and obedience to God. Good works and morality are also taught, but in the end I think the lessons are very different. I think where working on oneself is taught, it is in the context of fulfilling that belief or obedience.

    The reasons for following morality are even laid out to be different than Christianity.

    But - if you have a chance, read the chapter on Drama of Faith above.

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