Did they even have charters?JustJames said:"The orginal four lodges were named for the place where they met:
http://www.thefleece.org/goose.html
- Goose and Gridiron Ale-house in St. Paul's Church-yard;
- Crown Ale-house in Parker's Lane near Drury's Lane;
- Apple Tree Tavern in Charles Street, Covent Garden;
- Rummer and Grapes Tavern in Channel Row, Westminster."
As I recall the oldest of the 4 lodges was 50 years old and the youngest just 5 years old. So where did they get their charters?
JustJames said:To deal with this difficulty those lodges were later said to be time immemorial. I am sure that caused much amusement in the some 50 other lodges in London and Westminster.
There is a suggestion that 2 of the 4 lodges were established only for the purpose of forming a grand lodge that was overtly loyal to the German king on the English throne. Most lodges at the time were inclined toward the Stewart line.
JustJames said:"The organisation known as the Premier Grand Lodge of England was founded on 24 June 1717 as the 'Grand Lodge of London and Westminster'."
JustJames said:I wonder why they made such a modest claim originally.
Wait!?!?! Charters are an innovation?!?!?!Thanks for the information!!
"So where did they get their charters?" I will have to go back and check some of my books but I believe a group of Master Masons back in the day could form a lodge wherever one was needed.
Mike
Can you tell me, please, the source of this information? It is only for my research.Which is now thought to be a fabricated date used to to establish credibility within their written records...
Sure: http://freemasonsfordummies.blogspot.com/2016/09/is-official-date-of-our-founding-wrong.htmlCan you tell me, please, the source of this information? It is only for my research.
As far as I know it tooks about one year to prepare the meeting (likely to make the necessary agreements), while I think that the date as chosen to overlap the date of December 27th. In other words the idea was to cancel the reference to Saint John the Apostle with Saint John the Baptist. Unfortunately for them this did not happen so we deal with two Saint John.
"The orginal four lodges were named for the place where they met:
- Goose and Gridiron Ale-house in St. Paul's Church-yard;
- Crown Ale-house in Parker's Lane near Drury's Lane;
- Apple Tree Tavern in Charles Street, Covent Garden;
- Rummer and Grapes Tavern in Channel Row, Westminster."
And our Blue Lodges are Dry..... :/
Dry here in Texas....
And not complaining at all, It's a change to be able to have gatherings where alcohol is not a factor.
My consumption had dropped quite a bit since joining.
Dr. Anderson lists the 'Four Old Lodges' as:"The orginal four lodges were named for the place where they met:
http://www.thefleece.org/goose.html
- Goose and Gridiron Ale-house in St. Paul's Church-yard;
- Crown Ale-house in Parker's Lane near Drury's Lane;
- Apple Tree Tavern in Charles Street, Covent Garden;
- Rummer and Grapes Tavern in Channel Row, Westminster."
As I recall the oldest of the 4 lodges was 50 years old and the youngest just 5 years old. So where did they get their charters?
To deal with this difficulty those lodges were later said to be time immemorial. I am sure that caused much amusement in the some 50 other lodges in London and Westminster.
There is a suggestion that 2 of the 4 lodges were established only for the purpose of forming a grand lodge that was overtly loyal to the German king on the English throne. Most lodges at the time were inclined toward the Stewart line.
"The organisation known as the Premier Grand Lodge of England was founded on 24 June 1717 as the 'Grand Lodge of London and Westminster'."
I wonder why they made such a modest claim originally.