In Kentucky the Most Worshipful Grand Master issued an edict allowing stated communications to be held on the EA degree if the lodge so chooses, and informs the Grand Lodge of their decision in writing. As I understand, it is an attempt to get some of the Ea's that haven't returned proficiency back into the lodge and inspire them to continue. My home lodge Kingston #315 voted to do so, as we are very active with no concers of having enough members present to do so. We had our first such meeting a couple weeks ago and had only one EA in attendance, hopefully due to terrible weather/roads. He was the first Ea to sit in on a stated meeting in well over 100 years! They cannot ballot. Anyone have any thoughts on this move? I understand this is common practice in other parts of the world, not so much around here. lol
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Stated communication on EA degree
- Thread starter Mern
- Start date
Companion Joe
Premium Member
It's unnecessary. Here, EAs and FCs don't pay dues and wouldn't have a vote in any lodge business. As Zack said, if hearing how much the electric bill is or listening to a two-month debate on where to hang a picture inspires someone more than degree work, something is wrong.
JJones
Moderator
I think it's a good move and opening/conducting business in an EA wasn't unheard of before the Baltimore convention. Will it create more EA attendance? Maybe by a small amount but we've been able to open in an EA here in Texas for several years now but it hasn't helped EA retention much and nobody has popped their head back in to start learning the work all over. I think other factors are at play which turn brothers disinterested, being unable to sit through a business meeting and hear GL communications not being one of them.
rfuller
Premium Member
We have been opening in EA this year. We have a lot of EA's, though, and so it honestly has been nice for them. We opened MM this last stated meeting, and will again at our next stated meeting to discuss selling our building.
A few things I've noticed: with the exception of degree work, we never opened or closed in EA, so everyone was rusty. So we had all these EAs lined up, sitting in a stated meeting for the first time, and everyone is stumbling through the closing. I was embarrassed for our lodge and worried that our EA's would get the wrong impression.
BUT we've also just started bringing education back to our stated meetings, so there's more to them than just reading last month's minutes and going over the bills.
A few things I've noticed: with the exception of degree work, we never opened or closed in EA, so everyone was rusty. So we had all these EAs lined up, sitting in a stated meeting for the first time, and everyone is stumbling through the closing. I was embarrassed for our lodge and worried that our EA's would get the wrong impression.
BUT we've also just started bringing education back to our stated meetings, so there's more to them than just reading last month's minutes and going over the bills.
In NM, the line has been required to be able to open in all three degrees for many years.
Before I was Raised, I was glad to be included in the meetings, even the rare one with just business. It increases a sense of belonging in the new member.
Before I was Raised, I was glad to be included in the meetings, even the rare one with just business. It increases a sense of belonging in the new member.
rfuller
Premium Member
Don't get me wrong, I think you OUGHT to be able to open and close with 100% proficiency in any degree if you hold a seat. It's something that drives me up the wall that some people in the line can't.
BUT in my lodge, an office is held for the stated meetings. Our degree teams are totally different. During stated meetings, and on paper, I'm the JD. But during degrees, I'm typically JW. Some guys in our line aren't part of the degrees, and frankly, it shows. Some guys get nervous and trip over their words during meetings. I understand those things. It doesn't make it right. It doesn't bother me any less. But that's the reason why.
This is also the first year that I can remember opening a stated meeting in EA, so it was kind of a new thing to the guys in the line. Also, I hate that a progressive line even exists, but that's another argument for another thread.
Browncoat
Registered User
It IS necessary in my opinion.
My Lodge didn't have a petitioner for a long while, until I came along. Ohio can conduct business/open in any degree. I can say for a fact that had I been told that I couldn't attend a meeting for 3+ months, I would've lost interest and walked away.
No, I can't vote yet...and I accept the other benefits that I can't receive until I'm a full member. But I am still a member. I am still a Mason.
There's nothing earth-shattering at business meetings. Its kind of boring to listen to minutes and paying the bills. But I've also learned a lot about the order of things, who's who, and made friends with my Brothers. I have attended every meeting (except 1...had the flu) since my initiation. They know me by name, and that I'm a heck of a Euchre partner. Not to mention, that I'm always asking what I can help with and participate in.
Locking out new initiates is one of those things that's wrong with Freemasonry in my opinion, and I'm glad my state doesn't do it.
cacarter
Premium Member
I enjoy having communications in an EA degree and if done wisely and done with masonic education like rfuller mentioned, it can be beneficial. I would hope that no lodge would open on an EA lodge simply because it was "easier" than opening a MM lodge if only Masters were present. It's all for the sake of saving time and making meetings "faster" to "get more brothers at meetings." Maybe try more substance?
I also think that if not practiced by lodges, opening in a masters lodge and calling down to FC or EA could be difficult for a lodge if the situation were ever to require it.
I also think that if not practiced by lodges, opening in a masters lodge and calling down to FC or EA could be difficult for a lodge if the situation were ever to require it.
Companion Joe
Premium Member
Freemasonry isn't fast food. The fact I had to wait a few months to be a "full" member, as it were, didn't deter me. In fact, I see it as a method of putting a fire under someone to get their lectures turned in and get their degrees. Freemasonry is a progressive science, and knowledge is attained by degrees, not thinking you should be entitled to every benefit right out of the gate.
I see this as a precursor to one-day degree programs where you get EA, FC, MM in the course of a few hours. My state doesn't allow it, and I would adamantly oppose such a proposal.
I see this as a precursor to one-day degree programs where you get EA, FC, MM in the course of a few hours. My state doesn't allow it, and I would adamantly oppose such a proposal.
Bro Darren
Premium Member
Here is Australia, EA's are welcome at all stated meetings, even the ones where a 2nd or 3rd degree is happening.
I went to our January meeting as an EA and they were raising one of my brothers to a 3rd Degree MM.
The Lodge was opened in the first and then in the 2nd, but as the lodge was opening in the 2nd the SW was asked if all Freemasons met the criteria to be present and another EA and myself did not meet this criteria and at that point we left the meeting so that the Lodge could continue to open the meeting in the 2nd.
This was repeated when opening in the 3rd and a brother FC and the candidate for the 3rd had to leave at that point.
Whilst the candidate was being prepared and during the 3rd degree ritual, my 2 brothers (EA & FC) and myself sat in the south and spent lots of time getting to know each other and form a good foundation for a long lasting friendship.
In Australia you must be an EA for no less that 3 months before going into 2nd degree. You must also wait 12 months from the time of initiation before progressing to the 3rd.
I went to our January meeting as an EA and they were raising one of my brothers to a 3rd Degree MM.
The Lodge was opened in the first and then in the 2nd, but as the lodge was opening in the 2nd the SW was asked if all Freemasons met the criteria to be present and another EA and myself did not meet this criteria and at that point we left the meeting so that the Lodge could continue to open the meeting in the 2nd.
This was repeated when opening in the 3rd and a brother FC and the candidate for the 3rd had to leave at that point.
Whilst the candidate was being prepared and during the 3rd degree ritual, my 2 brothers (EA & FC) and myself sat in the south and spent lots of time getting to know each other and form a good foundation for a long lasting friendship.
In Australia you must be an EA for no less that 3 months before going into 2nd degree. You must also wait 12 months from the time of initiation before progressing to the 3rd.
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dfreybur
Premium Member
Opening in the EA degree for stated meetings is and always has been the world wide standard. Unless there is a reason to diverge from the world wide standard, that world wide standard should be adhered to. This is not quite the same thing as necessary.
There's nothing earth shattering in a mustard seed, either. There's a good allegory about mustard seeds that I think applies. The fellowship grows on regular attending brothers. Gradually building friendships. Gradually building comfort in our assemblies. Gradually building emulation of the most successful older members. Gradually building emulation of the kindest older members. Somewhere along the line, somehow as a part of the natural order of things, you go from being one of the seedlings striving to grow to being one of the plants dropping seeds. Alright, not exactly the same allegory. The one in the good book applies, too ...
Companion Joe
Premium Member
Darren,
Unless I misunderstand, there is a huge difference in Australian Masonry and my jurisdiction, or at least in terminology. Do I understand you have EAs and FCs sitting in open lodge during MM degree work?
As for the time, here it is 28 days between degrees - based on the lunar calendar dating back to when Lodges met on the first night of the full moon.
Unless I misunderstand, there is a huge difference in Australian Masonry and my jurisdiction, or at least in terminology. Do I understand you have EAs and FCs sitting in open lodge during MM degree work?
As for the time, here it is 28 days between degrees - based on the lunar calendar dating back to when Lodges met on the first night of the full moon.
Bro Darren
Premium Member
Joe,
EA's MUST leave the lodge before FC degree work commences as they cannot witness any of the FC degree work.
EA's & FC's MUST leave the lodge before MM degree work commences as they cannot witness any of the MM degree work.
Once the MM degree work is completed and the Lodge returns to the 1st, the new MM, FC and EA's are invited back into the lodge for the closing in the first.
Companion Joe
Premium Member
OK, when you said you "sat in the south" ... here that means either where the JW sits or the south side of the lodge where all the sideliners sit.
If you are opening/closing on multiple degrees on a single night, how long do the meetings last?
If you are opening/closing on multiple degrees on a single night, how long do the meetings last?
Bro Darren
Premium Member
Our meetings start at 7:30pm and close at about 9:00pm. We don't always open at every degree, only if we have degree work to be done. The other night the meeting ended at about 10:00pm
By the South I was referring to refreshment, not labour
Sent From My Freemasonry Pro App
By the South I was referring to refreshment, not labour
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Companion Joe
Premium Member
Here, stated meetings and degree work are totally separate. The stated business meetings usually last 45 mins to an hour. Our is the first Tuesday of each month. Degree work is done on other nights as needed. As we wouldn't confer different degrees on a single night, there wouldn't be any reason to open multiple degrees. You would only open on whatever degree you were about to confer. Degree work usually lasts two and half, three hours.
dfreybur
Premium Member
In two (maybe three) of my jurisdictions it's technically allowed to perform a degree at one of the break points of a stated meeting. Because of the length of any degree ceremony it's a rare occurrence. On a couple of occasions I've participated in a first degree done with as much business as possible rushed through or delayed to the next month.