Co-Masonry - Are they the same as non masons?

Discussion in 'Order of the Eastern Star' started by Lowcarbjc, Jul 10, 2014.

  1. Lowcarbjc

    Lowcarbjc Registered User

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    So I just met this lady friend who is part of co-masonry. She is a master mason in it. It's not eastern star but full blown freemasonry for both men and woman. Everyone calls each other brother.

    My constitution is male only. How would you handle situations, she comes and give you the right grip, do you return it. Do you not talk about rituals because of some obligation ? If she invites me to lodge I suppose the answer will always be no? Do I accept her as fellow mason?

    Your thoughts on this would be much appreciated.
     
  2. JJones

    JJones Moderator Staff Member

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    Unless I'm mistaken, all regular Grand Lodges consider all co-masonic organizations to be clandestine.

    As for visiting...think back to your obligation. That's all I'm saying. :)
     
  3. Lowcarbjc

    Lowcarbjc Registered User

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    Yes that is my personal understanding of it too. Thank you.
     
  4. admarcus1

    admarcus1 Registered User

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    One can very politely thank the person for the invitation to visit, but explain that because there is no recognition between the Grand Lodges, you cannot visit or discuss ritual, or anything like that.
    Co-Masonry has its adherents, and I'm sure it's members get something out of it, and have aims similar to ours. They do not defraud or cheat anyone, or pretend to be a part of any Grand Lodge that they are not. When I was researching Freemasonry before petitioning, I came across co-masonry, and it was always clear to me that it was a different institution. I wish them the best in their own journey.



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  5. dfreybur

    dfreybur Premium Member

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    Consider what visit means - Passing a tiler. Never go to pass her lodge's tiler and never invite her to pass your tiler.

    Social events that are open to non-members, don't wear any regalia and you're okay to attend as a non-Masonic social event. Feel free to tell stories about the funny stuff one of us past masters said at a meeting. There's plenty that can be discussed that has nothing to do with the degrees and obligations. You'd be able to swap stories like that with members of other fraternities. Not Masons, but I don't need lodge to tell me they are kin. Sort of like step family. Good folks.
     
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  6. Brother JC

    Brother JC Vigilant Staff Member

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    Yes.
     
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  7. BroBook

    BroBook Premium Member

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    What is that?


    Bro Book
    M.W.U.G.L. Of Fl: P.H.A.
    Excelsior # 43
    At pensacola
     
  8. Lowcarbjc

    Lowcarbjc Registered User

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    It just baffles me why they choose to do it under the name of freemasonry. In this photo is a woman who says she has been a freemason since 1976. I totally get OES and all the beautiful other female organizations but why do they interfere with something that works perfectly as a male fraternity and why is woman freemasonry so old and still alive if they will always not be recognized by us who took an obligation?

    ImageUploadedByMy Freemasonry Pro1405110126.170841.jpg
     
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  9. Glen Cook

    Glen Cook G A Cook Site Benefactor

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    It depends on the GL.
     
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  10. Glen Cook

    Glen Cook G A Cook Site Benefactor

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    If you are referring to co-masonry, I don't get the mixed fraternity either (I've been an officer in a mixed fraternal order), but it doesn't bother me. I totally get feminine freemasonry, and even UGLE has indicated they are otherwise regular in practise. See http://www.hfaf.org/ugle.htm
     
  11. admarcus1

    admarcus1 Registered User

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    Another fraternal organization, originally based on Freemasonry, but long since cut ties. They use some of the same terminology, but are quite different.

    http://oto-usa.org/


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  12. admarcus1

    admarcus1 Registered User

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    I'm not sure I understand how it is "interfering". If it is what people want to do, if they learn from it and improve themselves by it, if it is something they enjoy, more power to them.

    As for OES, I can understand why that might be objectionable to some people. The requirements of a) a connection to an MM for a woman to join, and b). The requirement that a MM be present for a meeting to open makes OES subordinate to Masonry. If I have those rules incorrect, it could be I was misinformed.



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  13. Lowcarbjc

    Lowcarbjc Registered User

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    Does anyone know of a link to the original source of this apparent statement from UGLE? http://www.hfaf.org/ugle.htm

    I very much doubt it, but I might be wrong.
     
  14. Glen Cook

    Glen Cook G A Cook Site Benefactor

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  15. Mike Martin

    Mike Martin Eternal Apprentice Premium Member

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    You won't find the statement online as it pre-dates today's widespread use of the Internet but I can guarantee you that it is genuine.

    However, you must be careful because the statement does NOT extend to the Co-Masons (your original topic) of Le Droit Humain as that organisation fails the regularity test on much, much more than the gender of its members.

    It should be noted that the women-only Orders do not recognise the Co-Masons either, except in France where masonically almost anything goes..
     
  16. Brother JC

    Brother JC Vigilant Staff Member

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    On the UGLE website there is the question, "Are there women Freemasons?" The response is, "Yes. Whilst UGLE, following the example of medieval stonemasons, is, and has always been, restricted to men, women Freemasons have two separate Grand Lodges, which are restricted to women."
     
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  17. Levelhead

    Levelhead Premium Member

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    Interesting subject. ..
     
  18. Roy_

    Roy_ Registered User

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    Just a few thoughts of a co-Mason. I don't know how things are in the USA (or the other countries of people reading this), but in my country people are pretty clear about which organisations have 'visiting agreements' and which do not. Members of the Dutch Grand Orient visit my lodge frequently, but not officially. This (of course) brings funny situations with greetings that cannot be returned, but it works well enough. Regular Masons are never invited, but those who which to visit are welcome and as far as I can judge do not make a secret of that in their own lodges. They simply think the division is old-fashioned and that us co-Masons do the same as they do.
    Now there is the argument of different rites, but this would be the same if a Mason visited a regular, foreign lodge too. Besides, experiencing another rite enriches ones view on ones own, not?
    In Belgium (I have heard) all male organisations besides the Regular Grand Lodge accept visits of the mixed obediences. This is something I will probably go and find out once I am raised Fellow. I wonder how this would work for my girlfriend. I expect that I will be able to visit and she does not, but time will tell.
    The bottom line, over here there are 'progressive' regular Masons who enjoy visiting mix lodges and we welcome them. I doubt it will harm the good men :)
    And to answer the initial question: yes and no. Yes who do the same as you. In fact, our rites are often based on yours. The differences there are no bigger between us and you than between different regular lodges.
    No, the organisation that first used the term "Freemasonry" (but forgot to copyright it) has terms we do not live up to which makes us another organisation that uses the same name. Not all of my brothers and sisters will agree with me about that, but in my opinion this is just the way it is and I wonder why it actually matters.
     
  19. Roy_

    Roy_ Registered User

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    I can tell you a bit about this side of the pont. The discussion pops up frequentely. In the early 20th century even quite seriously. In the end no further steps were taken than the adoption lodges that already existed here and there. Many Masons are for, much more are against the inclusion of Women. With a two-step Le Droit Humain was founded to fill the gap, but the Theosophical influences were regarded worse than the inclusion of women, yet they krept into regular Masonry in the Netherlands, the second did not. Yet, the Grand Master held a speech when the Dutch section of Le Droit Humain was founded stating that he regretted that it took so long before the possibility was created for women to join. This has never lead to recognition though and of course not, Freemasonry should live up to the Landmarks, should it not?
     
  20. BryanMaloney

    BryanMaloney Premium Member

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    A statement made by many Irregulars and Clandestines to rationalize their errors. Women are free to form their own independent Masonic societies should they so wish.
     

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