“Be it Free and Accepted or Ancient Free and Accepted we’re Master Masons”
“Be it Free and Accepted or Ancient Free and Accepted we’re Master Masons”
I don’t have understand the distinction you are trying to draw.
I don't get this either.“Be it Free and Accepted or Ancient Free and Accepted we’re Master Masons”
I don’t have understand the distinction you are trying to draw.
????Be careful what you ask for! You know better, Bro. Cook!
I think it is important to discuss racism that is in the craft. People don't want to talk about it but it is a serious problem in some areas.
AR does not recognise PHA.This thread has certainly drifted. I have no personal experience with PH Masonry. But, living in a southern state, I am well aware that considerable bigotry still exists. Unlikely that a black would be voted into most regular Lodges in this state as it requires only one black ball to reject and there is bound to be, at least, one bigot at most meetings. If I see a black wearing a Masonic ring or lapel pin it is with nearly 100% certainty he belongs to a PH Lodge. Arkansas GL Masonry is in such a mess currently, I do not even know if PH is recognized. (I belong to Lodge in Missouri just because of that "mess"). But, I do have occasional contact with black Masons. I get my health care at the VA hospital in Little Rock, Arkansas. Not unusual for a black veteran to approach me, stick out his hand and say "Hi Brother". He/they are Brothers, no doubt. As far as I am personally concerned, PH Brothers are recognized.
AR does not recognise PHA.
Is it worth pulling recognition of GLofAR over their obstinacy? Most think it's not; that local sovereignty beats support of appendent bodies. But consider - If some jurisdiction were to pull recognition of GLofAR there is a regular jurisdiction in that territory. The jurisdiction pulling the recognition could also recognize MWPHGLofAR and the problem is over. Because then the only solution available to GLofAR would be to BOTH recognize MWPHGLofAR AND clean up their own mess.
No jurisdiction is going to do this, but think about it. Screw up badly enough internally and you may well be required to solve more than one problem.
AR isn't the only jurisdiction with a huge problem. GLofTN brought politics or religion into lodge enough that GLofCA pulled recognition. Last I heard that's still the situation. I suggested to my mother lodge that they suggest the strategy I mention here, but they didn't get it. "We already recognize Prince Hall" was the response. Not being physically present I wasn't able to explain enough of the moving parts.
Several years ago GLofFL faced having their recognition pulled over bringing religion into tiled lodge spaces. They avoided that by voting down approval of the outgoing GM's edict as he was replaced the next year. Now they are moving towards recognition. Good for Florida for learning the hard way and correcting on their own.
Over the failure to recognise PHA, I don’t see that as a likely basis to withdraw recognition. I think it more likely they will lose recognition over the allegations they will refuse to issue a demit for AR Masons to join GLs which do recognise their PHA counterpart or to allow Arkansas members to sit in grand Lodges who recognise there PHA counterparts . Remember that it takes some time between an incident and the next annual communication for action to be taken.Is it worth pulling recognition of GLofAR over their obstinacy? Most think it's not; that local sovereignty beats support of appendent bodies. But consider - If some jurisdiction were to pull recognition of GLofAR there is a regular jurisdiction in that territory. The jurisdiction pulling the recognition could also recognize MWPHGLofAR and the problem is over. Because then the only solution available to GLofAR would be to BOTH recognize MWPHGLofAR AND clean up their own mess.
No jurisdiction is going to do this, but think about it. Screw up badly enough internally and you may well be required to solve more than one problem.
AR isn't the only jurisdiction with a huge problem. GLofTN brought politics or religion into lodge enough that GLofCA pulled recognition. Last I heard that's still the situation. I suggested to my mother lodge that they suggest the strategy I mention here, but they didn't get it. "We already recognize Prince Hall" was the response. Not being physically present I wasn't able to explain enough of the moving parts.
Several years ago GLofFL faced having their recognition pulled over bringing religion into tiled lodge spaces. They avoided that by voting down approval of the outgoing GM's edict as he was replaced the next year. Now they are moving towards recognition. Good for Florida for learning the hard way and correcting on their own.
Br.Is it worth pulling recognition of GLofAR over their obstinacy? Most think it's not; that local sovereignty beats support of appendent bodies. But consider - If some jurisdiction were to pull recognition of GLofAR there is a regular jurisdiction in that territory. The jurisdiction pulling the recognition could also recognize MWPHGLofAR and the problem is over. Because then the only solution available to GLofAR would be to BOTH recognize MWPHGLofAR AND clean up their own mess.
No jurisdiction is going to do this, but think about it. Screw up badly enough internally and you may well be required to solve more than one problem.
AR isn't the only jurisdiction with a huge problem. GLofTN brought politics or religion into lodge enough that GLofCA pulled recognition. Last I heard that's still the situation. I suggested to my mother lodge that they suggest the strategy I mention here, but they didn't get it. "We already recognize Prince Hall" was the response. Not being physically present I wasn't able to explain enough of the moving parts.
Several years ago GLofFL faced having their recognition pulled over bringing religion into tiled lodge spaces. They avoided that by voting down approval of the outgoing GM's edict as he was replaced the next year. Now they are moving towards recognition. Good for Florida for learning the hard way and correcting on their own.
Not arguing you were told that, but my understanding is that the prohibition only runs to AR Masons. If you see something official, it would be good to know.Br.
I agree. But situation in Arkansas likely to change. There is a certain mindset among those in power about doing things a certain way that often has nothing to do with the teachings of Masonry. There is a little light however. I understand the current GWM is trying to make changes that will remedy the situation. Hope so. Currently, I am told I would not be allowed to sit in the Arkansas Lodge where I was raised because I am a Shriner. Sad. I would have left Masonry completely but I still believe in what Masonry is SUPPOSED to be and my Missouri Lodge is what it should be.
Wow! Certainly a point to ponder.But consider - If some jurisdiction were to pull recognition of GLofAR there is a regular jurisdiction in that territory. The jurisdiction pulling the recognition could also recognize MWPHGLofAR and the problem is over. Because then the only solution available to GLofAR would be to BOTH recognize MWPHGLofAR AND clean up their own mess.
Over the failure to recognise PHA, I don’t see that as a likely basis to withdraw recognition. I think it more likely they will lose recognition over the allegations they will refuse to issue a demit for AR Masons to join GLs which do recognise their PHA counterpart or to allow Arkansas members to sit in grand Lodges who recognise there PHA counterparts . Remember that it takes some time between an incident and the next annual communication for action to be taken.
The more I read about the situation in Arkansas the more I am amazed. I had no idea that the situation these was so bad!The demit situation in Arkansas is so egregious a Brother from another state Lodge but living in Arkansas has not been able to get required demits and letters of good standing to allow petitioning our Missouri Lodge for membership. He has become a sort of non-person as far as Arkansas Masonry is concerned. (and I'm tempted to not capitalize 'Masonry' when used in connection with Arkansas)
Indeed. Luckily, Utah does not require a dimit to petition for affiliation, only proof of good standing, such as a dues card.Bro. Doug, heartily agree. My earlier post I meant to say "not likely to change". The demit situation in Arkansas is so egregious a Brother from another state Lodge but living in Arkansas has not been able to get required demits and letters of good standing to allow petitioning our Missouri Lodge for membership. He has become a sort of non-person as far as Arkansas Masonry is concerned. (and I'm tempted to not capitalize 'Masonry' when used in connection with Arkansas)
Which is the same reason I resist a national Grand Lodge, because we can have bad policies imposed nation wide and the individual mason will have little input.Yes. It is that bad. That is why I believe it would be best to have a central authority, like American Grand Lodge. Then they could step in and kick some butt. Sadly, that is not the case.
Have to agree. I am very much against a national governing body.Which is the same reason I resist a national Grand Lodge, because we can have bad policies imposed nation wide and the individual mason will have little input.