Swedish Rite, KTP and Red Cross

Discussion in 'The Swedish Rite' started by Kalip78, May 11, 2017.

  1. Kalip78

    Kalip78 Registered User

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    "Grand Lodges etc. in amity" section on SFMO's website wasn't revisited since 2009 so I have two questions for Swedish Rite Brethren:

    1) Is SFMO in amity with the Order of Holy Royal Arch Knight Templar Priests?
    2) Which degree in SwR can be visited by a member of the Order of the Red Cross of Constantine?

    Frats from Warsaw!
    Piotr
     
  2. Elexir

    Elexir Registered User

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    1) Im not to sure of what the status is, I will look around to see if I can find our martikel where there is a better list.

    2) Going by how we treat our finnish brethren, its around VIII, note that all degrees from VII are only open for christians.

    (Note: This is an answer from a Swedish brother, things might be different in the other countries)
     
  3. Elexir

    Elexir Registered User

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    In Poland we only seem to be in aminity with the National Grand Lodge. (Again, Sweden)
     
  4. chrmc

    chrmc Registered User

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    In general it would be easier to look at your Blue Lodge and Grand Lodge to determine amity and whether or not you can visit at all.
    As for the degrees, do not believe Red Cross gives you anything special. Royal Arch will usually let you into the VI degree, and if you have gone through the Commandry you'd probably be able to get into at least the VIII degree.
     
  5. chrmc

    chrmc Registered User

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    Are you sure about that one? I wouldn't think that they would necessarily stand on the Christian requirement for a brother that was only visiting? But they might.
     
  6. Elexir

    Elexir Registered User

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    Our bylaws state that brothers outside of Denmark, Norway, Iceland or Finland visiting the chapter has to sign a form declaring that they are christian.
     
  7. Ripcord22A

    Ripcord22A Site Benefactor

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    Wow

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  8. Glen Cook

    Glen Cook G A Cook Site Benefactor

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    I do not believe RCC qualifies one for attendance in anything but RCC. May I ask why you think it would?
     
  9. Kalip78

    Kalip78 Registered User

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    Dear Brother, it's bacause SFMO's webside says so:

    England
    - United Grand Lodge of England
    - Supreme Grand Royal Arch Chapter of England
    - Supreme Council 33° of the Ancient and Accepted Rite for England and
    Wales and its Districts and Chapters Overseas
    - Great Priory of England and Wales
    - The Grand Imperial Conclave for England and Wales and its Divisions and
    Conclaves Overseas of the Masonic and Military Order of the Red Cross of
    Constantine and the Orders of the Holy Sepulchre and of St John the
    Evangelist

    :)

    Frats!
    Piotr
     
  10. Glen Cook

    Glen Cook G A Cook Site Benefactor

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    Well, it says they are in amity. That is somewhat different than providing the necessary qualification to attend. Does membership in AAR qualify one to attend?
     
  11. chrmc

    chrmc Registered User

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    Exactly what Glen says. The fact that they are in amity means that they recognize the body as regular and that they accept the degrees. After that you'll have to determine what degree you can visit. As mentioned earlier I doubt that they would look to the York rite side degrees, but mainly go by the main ones.

    But if you go to visit the degrees to hit are really IV/V and then VIII in my opinion. They are the coolest, though VIII can be hard to get the full meaning of if you don't have someone translate for you.

    I and III are also good, but they'll be more familiar too you, through III is definitely worth seeing.
     
    Last edited: May 12, 2017
  12. chrmc

    chrmc Registered User

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    Interesting, never knew that though it makes sense. Assume that's only to visit the Chapter (Kapitlet)?
    I'll have to ask some of my friends in Denmark to hear what the standard is there, but would assume it's the same.
     
  13. Elexir

    Elexir Registered User

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    Yes only for Kapitlet (since its from VII).

    Btw, if a RCC arrived from Finland there is a set degree wich we would greet him as. Some food for thought.
     
  14. Kalip78

    Kalip78 Registered User

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    Maybe it's my English...

    I have asked only one question about RCC: Which degree in SwR can be visited by a member of the Order of the Red Cross of Constantine?

    If one GL is in amity with other GL then the intervisitation is allowed. That's how I understand status "in amity". Correct me if I'm wrong (I might be).

    S&F
     
  15. SimonM

    SimonM Registered User

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    You have to check through the official channels to get an answer to your question. My guess would be either up to VI or up to VIII. As been said earlier the IV-V and VIII are well worth a visit but a introduction by a local brother is recommended.
     
  16. Ripcord22A

    Ripcord22A Site Benefactor

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    You aren't incorrect. However when speaking of the side orders your GL must be "in aminity" with what ever side orders "Governing Body" so that the GL membership may join it. For example the UGLE isnt in aminity with the EASTERN STAR. Also the GL of Arkansas no longer recognizes the Shrine. There for in both those GLs their membership cant join eastern star or shrine, respectively.

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  17. Kalip78

    Kalip78 Registered User

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    Well, I think it differs from country to country. Just look at the UGLE. English GL ofcially recognise only one appendant body, that is RA. But still they let their members to join many different orders. So if they don't forbid you to join, you can do it. Kind of negative selection I would say. ;-)

    Personaly I am member of appendant bodies in Scotland and Germany and my GL has no offcial relations with them. Recognition is on the GL's level, that is my GL recognises GL that reconises (or has nothing against) concrete appendant body. :)

    Frats!
    Piotr
     
  18. Brother JC

    Brother JC Vigilant Staff Member

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    Source?
     
  19. Scoops

    Scoops Registered User

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    http://d3pl5apc7wn4y0.cloudfront.net/images/files/Book_of_Constitutions_-_Craft_Rules_Jan_2017.pdf

    Page 14 - Preliminary declaration

    "By the solemn Act of Union between the two Grand Lodges of
    Free-Masons of England in December 1813, it was ‘declared and
    pronounced that pure Antient Masonry consists of three degrees and
    no more, viz., those of the Entered Apprentice, the Fellow Craft,
    and the Master Mason, including the Supreme Order of the Holy
    Royal Arch’."

    UGLE makes no official mention of any other appendant bodies anywhere else in it's literature.

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  20. Kalip78

    Kalip78 Registered User

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    Well, Bro. Scoops was first. ;-)

    Frats!
     
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