Lodge of Younger Initiates

Discussion in 'Locating a Lodge' started by Derek Barclay, Nov 9, 2015.

  1. JamestheJust

    JamestheJust Registered User

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    Sometimes when contemplating a question we discover that we have believed things without justification or evidence. This can be an embarrassing discovery.
     
  2. Derek Barclay

    Derek Barclay Registered User

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    Isn't that the definition of faith? Though I don't view it esteemed, I find no reason to be embarrassed by being wrong. One should feel grateful to discover they've been mistaken. It is an opportunity to diminish ignorance, and that is something I do value.
     
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  3. JamestheJust

    JamestheJust Registered User

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    Perhaps just one person might but by the time you have a lodge-full facing the same issue, it is not a simple adjustment.
     
  4. coachn

    coachn Coach John S. Nagy Premium Member

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    The one I belong to does.
    My GL has only one religious requirement, Belief in God. A religion is not required, and that is why I disagreed with your other comment and why I disagree with this comment as well.

    I do not have "to go to a church, a synagogue, a temple or mosque" to get right with God. I do that much better on my own and without such corrupting influences.
     
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  5. Glen Cook

    Glen Cook G A Cook Site Benefactor

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    Oh my dear boy, no one is threatened or even angered. You place far too much import in your exchanges here.

    Let me try an analogy. A man goes into a hospital and asks about working as a physician. He is asked if he went to medical school. He tells them no, but he is thinking about it. They tell him to come back when he does so. He returns the next day and the same conversation ensues. And the next day. After awhile they don't understand why he continues to do this as it is fruitless.
     
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  6. NY.Light.II

    NY.Light.II Registered User

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    That's quite the statement.
     
  7. Derek Barclay

    Derek Barclay Registered User

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    Perhaps.

    Well I'd have to agree that scenario would be fruitless. Though now I think you may be placing far too much import on this forum.

    I find it analogous to a person going to the only school in town, asking to be taught. The teachers tell him to come back when he's a little more educated.
     
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  8. Glen Cook

    Glen Cook G A Cook Site Benefactor

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    Well, now we know how you feel about the forum.

    I agree with your example. If you apply to a university, it is usually expected that you have a minimum education. Of course, there are unaccredited online diploma mills to which you may apply--and you have done.
     
    Last edited: Nov 11, 2015
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  9. Derek Barclay

    Derek Barclay Registered User

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    The school in my analogy is the fraternity, not this forum; and like all analogies it is not a perfect representation. It's also a primary school rather than a university.

    I'm aware that there are other avenues for one to be educated or to educate one's self. I simply enjoy discussing these things for no other reason than it's interesting. Even these nodes of discord can be moments of instruction. I'm learning just by conversing, which is why I enjoy it. Of course to do so at anyone's detriment is not desirable. If this is not an open forum or yall are tired of the exchange, I'll stop. But you have to tell me blatantly. To simply disagree is a sign of want to continue the dialogue.
     
    Last edited: Nov 11, 2015
  10. coachn

    coachn Coach John S. Nagy Premium Member

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    Yup. It very well should be.
     
    Last edited: Nov 23, 2015
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  11. coachn

    coachn Coach John S. Nagy Premium Member

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    The school in your inaccurate but telling analogy, and your characterization of it being a primary school, is not the Fraternity. You might think it is, but unless you want to learn how to participate in amateur acting society, you're chasing the wrong bus.

    The forum is easily equated to a teacher's bar. We are informing you on what is required to participate in the society and the facilities that recognize each other around the globe.

    To continue with the "analogy": You've been carded, found lacking and are being treated accordingly. You, for no other reason than finding it interesting (indicating that you either do not actually have an "end-in-mind" for your investment of time and energy and are thus merely an undirected wanderer OR you are once again found to be not honest in your motivations), have decided to hang out at the bar, even though you already know that you can't participate in the actual organization.
     
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  12. Derek Barclay

    Derek Barclay Registered User

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    It is the fraternity, and it is a primary school - the analogy I mean. I'm sorry you think otherwise.

    I'm not sure what you mean by 'amateur acting society' and 'chase the bus.' I have tried to show how I'm being sincere, but you continue to think I have ulterior motives of some kind. Maybe you're projecting.

    I attend biker bars yet have no interest in learning to ride. I simply enjoy good talk with good people.
     
  13. coachn

    coachn Coach John S. Nagy Premium Member

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    It is quite clear that this is merely an exercise in mental pleasuring on your part and any seed that might be spilled shall land on barren soil. Time to pull the plug.
     
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  14. MRichard

    MRichard Mark A. Ri'chard Premium Member

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    It is an open forum, anyone can post. There are cowans and eavesdroppers here as well posing as something they are not. Basically, when you say that you don't believe in a higher power, there is nothing to discuss anymore for most. That is a fundamental issue upon which the fraternity is based. Posting here will not change your beliefs. Only you can do that. Atheists need not apply!

    After looking through some of your older posts, I think I am starting to see a pattern. You thought about petitioning a clandestine body. Maybe you are not interested in a regular and recognized lodge. If you say that, it makes a difference as some wouldn't care if you didn't believe in a higher power and were trying to petition a clandestine lodge. Now, it is only an issue if you are trying to join a regular and/or recognized lodge.
     
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2015
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  15. Derek Barclay

    Derek Barclay Registered User

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    I can see how one reading my posts would deem them sarcastic or dismissive or insincere, but that's the failure of text - to be unable to convey tone. I get no pleasure out of being misunderstood.

    It's not like I'm asking, "Why can't I join?" over and over again. I asked that question. The answer I seemed to get was, "Because thems the rules." I followed up with, "Why is a dogmatic attachment to rules a good thing?" That is a completely different question. I've surrendered to the notion that I may never be a member of a regular order of Freemasonry, but I don't see that as a reason to stop talking to you guys.

    I only started investigating irregular lodges after learning about the rule regarding one's beliefs.
     
  16. MRichard

    MRichard Mark A. Ri'chard Premium Member

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    I don't think you are being sarcastic or anything like that. When we see someone asking about petitioning, we assume they want to join a regular and or recognized lodge. Regarding questions about believing in a higher power, it is fundamental to freemasonry. It would be hard for me to explain without discussing things I cannot openly discuss. But someone else may be able to do a better job of that. Most guys won't remember your older posts so you have to remind them of your views when you start a new thread or they make have not seen your other posts at all. Then that way you could avoid having to deal with the same issues over and over again.
     
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2015
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  17. Derek Barclay

    Derek Barclay Registered User

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    Okay that's understandable. Thanks.
     
  18. eman1369

    eman1369 Registered User

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    How old do you have to be to join a lodge?
     
  19. Brother JC

    Brother JC Vigilant Staff Member

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    It depends on where you live; 18 some places, 21 in others.
     
  20. CLewey44

    CLewey44 Registered User

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    I think your honesty on not being sure if you believe in a Supreme Being or not is admirable since you could simply lie on your petition as some people do. Good on you there. Who would know otherwise except you and God in your final hour.

    Simply put, no hurry. Find yourself, figure out your beliefs or disbeliefs and go from there. Masonry is time consuming and you're young. If you just show up on your first 3 degree nights and then never come again, you've really wasted your time and money; especially if you haven't grasped the concept or really bought into it to the point of being willing to invest time and thought into it.

    No rush, many people are in their 30s, 40s, 50s and beyond when they join. We initiated people in their 70s. Joining at 20 will not really put you ahead in any way at all.
     

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