Thomas Stright
Premium Member
I wouldn't mind seeing our dues doubled.... Would still be cheap IMHO.
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'The Elitist Inside'
- Thread starter CLewey44
- Start date
Warrior1256
Site Benefactor
Great!
JJones
Moderator
Is there disinfo that says we are expensive online? Serious question because I haven't seen it.
I think younger generations perceive our fraternity as something that's old, exclusive, mysterious, and respectable and, because of this, they assume it will be expensive. Millenials know that quality things should be expensive and we should be flattered that they associate our fraternity with quality, but I think the disconnect begins the moment they walk into many of our doors and realize that entire masonic generations have done everything they could to make the fraternity as mundane as possible.
CLewey44
Registered User
Unfortunately, this is true in many cases.
Ripcord22A
Site Benefactor
See i dont think that quality necessarily needs to be expensive, and i guess technically im a millenial(that was so hard to type)
I think levis are better quality then Lucky brand jeans and luckys are WAAAAY more expensive. As for dues if they had been as much as is being called for in the article i wouldnt have been able to join when i did.
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I think levis are better quality then Lucky brand jeans and luckys are WAAAAY more expensive. As for dues if they had been as much as is being called for in the article i wouldnt have been able to join when i did.
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JJones
Moderator
It was really hard for me to type at first also. I was born in '83 so I was born at a time when I could probably be called either generation.
You're right, sometimes you're just paying for a name and Freemasonry is THE name as far as fraternities go. That alone doesn't justify dues like are mentioned in the article.
I think the real key point to all of this dues talk is the fact that simply raising dues doesn't guarantee anything and I'm in agreement that raising dues jsut for the sake of raising them is likely to run people off. Now, if that money is going back into the making the lodge a better/nicer place and improving the overall lodge experience (better food/catering, guest speakers, new carpet, paint the walls, etc.) then the dues increase won't seem so arbitrary to the membership.
MarkR
Premium Member
I'm a Wrangler guy, myself!
CLewey44
Registered User
I'm with you on that, I wouldn't have been able to join at those astronomical numbers (and maybe that would indicate I'm not ready at that time) but it would weed out a lot less desirable folks and make fellows take it a bit more seriously. If I dropped that kind of money, I'd be at every single meeting available if they were good. Which leads to the next point, raising dues doesn't necessarily equate better lodge experience, however if the money was put to good use it would provide for better experiences and potentially a better 'selling point' to potential new members. To me, it's not just about raising the dues but improving the lodge and the lodge experience.
Ripcord22A
Site Benefactor
Derek Harvey
Registered User
My step daughter told my wife" he's not a real freemason that would cost $100,000 lol
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Warrior1256
Site Benefactor
BullDozer Harrell
Registered User
Well said Brother. Not sure what generation i fall in at 45yrs old. But you said something that's strikingly 'old school' and makes you even more ok with me.
Quality doesn't need to be expensive. I spend my money on jeans without a name at the discount store and find they fit better than the high end name brand pants out there in the big name stores.
Same as shoes. The sneakers i might spend $50-60 tops are more comfortable and seem to outlast the fancy brands.
CLewey44
Registered User
I think we are veering off track and it makes anyone that agrees with the article, whether partly or completely, seem a little shallow and too concerned with physical things like nice cars and whatnot. I understand being on the level and being humble etc is apart of Masonry but the lodge experience can always stand for improvement and have some respect thrown towards it. Lets be on the level, but lets be on a higher level. Lets raise ourselves up to that level if possible.
One point of this article was not only 'lets charge more and buy flamboyant xyz articles for the lodge and act like arrogant pricks' One of the points was also that by charging more, it does allow for less members being herded in like cattle. For 50 bucks you can learn all the secrets of Masonry type of thing which cheapens the entire fraternity. One thing I remember, my wife was so curious about the lodge and she had heard about how nice the lodges were where she is from and had seen them from the outside. She's also an architect by trade and lived in Europe/Asia most of her life. Later I took her to a family event and she was so shocked as to how out dated and how poorly some people presented themselves. The intrigue suddenly left her just from a family event with the dated furniture and décor, fold out metal chairs and plastic fold out tables. Cheap wood paneling and paper thin doors. It lacked anything she ever expected from a Masonic lodge. The same applies to new members when they get in and leave less than impressed. It helps guard the west from less desirable folks. It allows for a nicer experience when fellas do show up and increased attendance hopefully. My lodge may have 200 members but on any given night, only 10-18 shows up. That sort of participation says something and it says, we are failing our members and if charging more is one answer, so mote it be.
One point of this article was not only 'lets charge more and buy flamboyant xyz articles for the lodge and act like arrogant pricks' One of the points was also that by charging more, it does allow for less members being herded in like cattle. For 50 bucks you can learn all the secrets of Masonry type of thing which cheapens the entire fraternity. One thing I remember, my wife was so curious about the lodge and she had heard about how nice the lodges were where she is from and had seen them from the outside. She's also an architect by trade and lived in Europe/Asia most of her life. Later I took her to a family event and she was so shocked as to how out dated and how poorly some people presented themselves. The intrigue suddenly left her just from a family event with the dated furniture and décor, fold out metal chairs and plastic fold out tables. Cheap wood paneling and paper thin doors. It lacked anything she ever expected from a Masonic lodge. The same applies to new members when they get in and leave less than impressed. It helps guard the west from less desirable folks. It allows for a nicer experience when fellas do show up and increased attendance hopefully. My lodge may have 200 members but on any given night, only 10-18 shows up. That sort of participation says something and it says, we are failing our members and if charging more is one answer, so mote it be.
Warrior1256
Site Benefactor
True.
JJones
Moderator
Cheap dues (and a lax West Gate) allow for lots of dabblers to enter the fraternity. A dabbler is someone who's 'kind of' interested and goes ahead and petitions because it's so cheap and easy to get in. We're really practically giving away the secrets of our fraternity at bargain bin rates.
Higher dues may run a few men off, but from what I've read over the years this number tends to be very low, provided the lodge invests that money back into the Masonic experience. It would also seem that those that remain are more likely to be active in the lodge. This is likely because they are paying more money so they are determined to get everything out of their membership that they can.
Higher dues may run a few men off, but from what I've read over the years this number tends to be very low, provided the lodge invests that money back into the Masonic experience. It would also seem that those that remain are more likely to be active in the lodge. This is likely because they are paying more money so they are determined to get everything out of their membership that they can.
CLewey44
Registered User
W. Bro. Jones, I think we're on the same page with this.
Warrior1256
Site Benefactor
Agreed!
JJones
Moderator
Wow, nobody has ever called me that before. We don't address past masters like that here in Texas, although I wish we did.
Thomas Stright
Premium Member
Same here...
I will say that the reason I want dues to be doubled is $10/mo is a joke. Lodge would be able to do so much more IMHO if dues were $20/mo. minimum...
Keith C
Registered User
I recall when I set up my interview with the investigating committee they mentioned they prefer to meet at the candidate's home to "see how they live" and to be sure by observation and discussion with the candidate and family that the Dues "Wouldn't be a burden financially for the family." I was thinking to myself "OMG, the yearly dues must be pretty high"...Though I was fairly certain I could afford it whatever it would be. Turns out dues for our lodge are $90.00 / year. I was a bit surprised that they were that low and the lodge was concerned that $90 would prove to be a 'burden."
I get the feeling the dues have been at this level for a long time, and perhaps when put in place would have been considered expensive. The financial situation in our lodge, however, make is very difficult to suggest raising the dues. We have substantial funds in reserve and even tough we are currently spending significant amounts on building improvement, there is no real justification to raise dues. Our programs and our building do need improvements, but they are systematically being done well within the resources we have at hand and more money wouldn't make them go faster.
I think one of the biggest obstacles to improvement of the Lodge, either physically or in programs is resistance to change, no lack of funds in our case.
I get the feeling the dues have been at this level for a long time, and perhaps when put in place would have been considered expensive. The financial situation in our lodge, however, make is very difficult to suggest raising the dues. We have substantial funds in reserve and even tough we are currently spending significant amounts on building improvement, there is no real justification to raise dues. Our programs and our building do need improvements, but they are systematically being done well within the resources we have at hand and more money wouldn't make them go faster.
I think one of the biggest obstacles to improvement of the Lodge, either physically or in programs is resistance to change, no lack of funds in our case.