Advice For Esoteric Masons

Discussion in 'General Freemasonry Discussion' started by Bro_Vick, Jul 24, 2013.

  1. Godfrey Daniel

    Godfrey Daniel Registered User

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    affects
     
    Last edited: Sep 9, 2013
  2. Perry

    Perry Registered User

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    Don't be an esoteric Mason in Texas, may get you run out GL. Stay in the closet.


    My Freemasonry HD
     
  3. JJones

    JJones Moderator Staff Member

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    I realize you may have been trying to be funny but the truth is I think that's the situation in a nutshell. The majority (good ol' boy club) views esoteric masons as a weird minority with dangerous ideas that could scare people away. I hope one day the tables turn though.
     
  4. dfreybur

    dfreybur Premium Member

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    Please come out of the closet. Please don't give the knife and fork folks the false idea that they are alone in Masonry. Please make "occult" mean "in a tiled meeting".

    In the long run meaning is what is desired by the young generation. That includes historical, philosophical, mystical, you name it. In the long run they are the majority in the next generation. In the short run it's a question of how much damage is being done to stem the tide.

    How many Masons does it take to change a light bulb? Change? We don't tolerate change!

    Please do not participate in that. Please come out of the closet in our tiled meetings. Talk about what it means to you. The hidden meaning you have noticed. The feelings that were triggered.
     
  5. Perry

    Perry Registered User

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    Hope it works for someone, nine years ago as WM, I began an educational program by simply bringing articles from Masonic scholars (Newton, Pike, Hall) even a little Joseph Campbell for some open floor discussion. By Dec. I was asked to stop.
    Then I heard a group from Ft. Worth tried bringing in some esoteric ideas into Lodge, and maybe had broke the bearer, until the GL of Texas got wind of it, and it ends with some members being expelled. Never heard what the charges were.
    As I doing still hear from the Lodge when they degree work help, I still hear someone say "did you leave your Pagan ideas at home". There is no sense arguing, I do still drive to Guthrie SR once or twice a year ( I have always felt welcome there) and studying Golden Dawn. This forum does seem interesting as having discovered it a few weeks ago. So peace and harmony prevails over ignorance.


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  6. JohnnyFlotsam

    JohnnyFlotsam Premium Member

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    Spot on, Brother, though I think you understate it a bit. Heck with the "dangerous ideas", just being "different" is scary enough to some that they feel the need to react as they have. I suspect it's the same crowd that wants to make sure, through legislation, that no yamulkes or turbans are ever worn in lodge, or that the KJV Bible, and only the KJV Bible, ever rests on the altar, or <insert superficial difference here>.
     
  7. crono782

    crono782 Premium Member

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    I was talking to a brother the other day and mentioning that some lodges do indeed have non-Christian brethren and may opt to have their VSL (torah, quran, etc) on the altar during degrees and open lodge. I got the most bewildered look like I had just slapped him in the face or something. >.<
     
  8. JJones

    JJones Moderator Staff Member

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    I think one of the tricks with introducing this kind of stuff is that you really have to know your audience and be willing to ease them into things. For example, I'd personally love to hear a lecture on Hermitism or Kabbalah but I think it'd do more to alienate the brethren than anything else if it were presented right out of the blue.

    It's a shame to hear how things with poorly for your lodge though.

    Agreed, I think there's a lot of legislation which gets introduced as a sort of 'knee jerk' reaction to any practices which might be different from 'how it's always been done'.
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2013
  9. FlBrother324

    FlBrother324 Registered User

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    Also, read the articles on near-death.com


    Br. Vick,

    I didnt know they had this kind of information available... It just never occured to me to look into it!
    Thank you for the link. A lot of what those people related in there scenarios is spot on to things
    I have personally experienced, as was discussed and related to in my post; "Has anyone had visits from God or their
    Diety." It is amazing how similar their recollections of events were to mine, how real they appeard to be to them as well.

    I would also like to add....

    As the presiding Master of my Lodge, we have 2 training nights per month, where we practice the rituals, and floor work, as well as Masonic literary teachings of our esteemed Brethren such as Pike and others. This helps the Brothers to learn the meanings behind their ritual work, not just a repetitive or mimicking of the daily Lodge work. It reinforces our history and the lessons behind Freemasonry which is the foundation behind our great Fraternity.

    Thank you again for the info.

    Yours, in His service.



    My Freemasonry HD
     
  10. dfreybur

    dfreybur Premium Member

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    It's interesting but inevitable that discussion turned towards religions. While religions do indulge in the esoteric, the esoteric is independent of not just any one religion in specific but from all of the. This is a lesson that is slow to learn by some, never to learn by others, staunchly resisted by others still.

    One of the reasons anti-Masonry exists is that those Masons interested in the esoteric, mystical, occult, whatever term you decide to use for it, eventually learn that the topic is independent of all religions. That's a stance to be opposed by those who want their religion to claim a monopoly on such topics or who want to suppress such topics altogether.

    I am unapologetic about that. To the extent there are anti-Masons who object to us because some of us do exactly what they object to, that's a good sign for the long term health of the open minded teachings of Masonry. To the extent that there are Masons among us who study such topics, that's a good sign for the long term health of the open minded teachings of Masonry.

    If we have brothers among those who staunchly oppose, that's a problem that should not be treated by gong into or staying in the closet. Trying to delete the meaning in Masonry is to be opposed. We see this on multiple fronts. Complaints in this thread. The nonsense about Chamber of Reflection this year. And now a "study" about Table Lodge.
     
  11. Michaelstedman81

    Michaelstedman81 Premium Member

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    Anyone have another source for the blog that Bro. Vick posted a link for in his original post? When I click on it, it goes to a page from Blogger that saysthe blog doesn't exist anymore. After reading his response to it and the rest of the discussion, I am really interested in reading the article or blog.
     
  12. BryanMaloney

    BryanMaloney Premium Member

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    A ladder--most people get this.
    What is it?--most people get this.
    What is its esoteric meaning?--most people get completely blocked here, and even those who start to get this grab whatever is fed to them first as the sole "esoteric meaning".

    The most powerful thing about symbols is that they mean nothing.
    This is a secret so deep that I can say or write it everywhere and be at no risk of revealing anything to anyone not able to handle it.
    Any object that has been used for a few millenia could fill a large book just listing all the different (and sometimes opposite) things it has been used to symbolize. This is even more true when we move from objects to words or activities.
     
  13. dfreybur

    dfreybur Premium Member

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    Different people find different meanings in the same symbol. Is this why to state that symbols mean nothing?

    I suggest that symbols have context and that context defines a range of meanings. When inspecting a symbol for meaning we should ponder a range of meanings. Which meanings are circumspect; which are not. Then we should go with the center of that circle as the primary intended meaning with the rest of the range as the layers of meaning. This approach does yield different meanings for different people but in a way that does not mean nothing.
     
  14. crono782

    crono782 Premium Member

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    I think that should be read as "they mean nothing *on their own*". I agree, in the absence of context a symbol is meaningless.. although even a symbol without somebody else's meaning can be given meaning by anybody I reckon and therefore any object can potentially be a symbol for an unlimited number of things. hah
     
  15. Brother_Steve

    Brother_Steve Premium Member

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    I think the brother's post was not written the way he thought it to be because the former makes no sense if you take his statement at face value.

    For example, the S and C is the symbol for our fraternity however it has a deeper meaning to a mason than what the average person might be able to detract from it.
     
  16. BroBook

    BroBook Premium Member

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    True story I had been doing serious research in
    1984 for months religion and history being the focus. A childhood friend showed me his ring and it meant nothing until he told me the name of the organization . After then I researched it!!!


    My Freemasonry HD
     
  17. BryanMaloney

    BryanMaloney Premium Member

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    We talk about symbols and I wrote something that "makes no sense if you take [it] at face value".
    Hmmm....
     
  18. dfreybur

    dfreybur Premium Member

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    Chortle. It's one of those Zen koans I say.
     
  19. Brother JC

    Brother JC Vigilant Staff Member

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    Obvious allegory is not, you say? Hmm, yes, yes.
     
  20. CLewey44

    CLewey44 Registered User

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    Basically, I think Masonry is as esoteric as you want it to be. If you want to be in a good ol boys club that eats KFC off paperplates, votes on paying the bills and whether or not to let 'Steve's boy' in or not and then close, so be it. That's what's best for you. If you want more on the esoteric side of things, do some research and find the right place for you. You may have to drive a little, but it's better to drive an hour or so once every month or two than to go sit in lodge twice a month and gain nothing from it.
     

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