Origins of Masonry?

Discussion in 'The Voting Booth' started by TCShelton, Oct 1, 2008.


What do you believe to be the origins of Masonry?

  1. Knights Templar

    22 vote(s)
  2. Stone Masons

    58 vote(s)
  3. Other

    29 vote(s)
  1. Frater Cliff Porter

    Frater Cliff Porter Premium Member

    Bryan you have decided to read things into statements that have not been made. Can you show me where Gnosticism was provided as a mandatory path?

    And I am not sure anyone historically knows what the "oldest" Christianity is. If you were going to use written text, then yes, what we would call Gnostic Christianity is the oldest.

    As to the apostle's, who knows what was in each man's heart? I read what was allegedly written by them or ascribed to them and take them at their word.

    But out of curiosity, what does it matter what anyone else believes as long as you have a wonderfully rich walk with Christ? Shouldn't Masonry be strong enough to allow for the difference of opinion on matters of faith? Shouldn't we as people be open to such things? The idea that a man's faith is his own and that we need not worry about their walk as much as our own?

    As far as your sarcasm in regards to Evangelicalism, I would provide that if you wanted to demonstrate an Evangelical ideal of a Christ like life was the example meant by the apostles and by Christ you should not be demeaning and argumentative. Being loving, forgiving, and willing to talk (such as Paul in Corinth for example) would set out to show how you believe.

    In the end, if you are a Mason and you are an Evangelical Christian how can someone deny you this? Even if the head of some Gnostic order showed up and said, "No Bryan you are not a Mason" or as you put it a "full Mason"...would it change anything? No, of course it would not. You would still be a Mason and whatever your chosen faith.

    I was told by the Lutheran church when I was withheld continued membership in the church of my youth because of my Masonic membership that I was in essence, not a good Christian, because I was Mason.

    In the end, they couldn't take Christ from me anymore than I could from you.
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2012
  2. Traveling Man

    Traveling Man Premium Member

    So I took my membership (religious) elsewhere... :001_rolleyes:
  3. Star Mztyk

    Star Mztyk Registered User

    .... I would have to vote... Other. The reason being that if we not only look at the ancient civilizations that built equally as old Temples to chart the face of the heavens, fixed stars....and other particular occurances as the Soltices and Equinoxes, they were obviously studying the Blueprint of the night sky for one purpose. To Built upon Earth that which is in Heaven.....and manifest the 4 Square (4 Cardinal Directions) New Jerusalem.

    Merry Christmas.... and let us remember the Three Magi ....the scholars of their time.
  4. calo

    calo Registered User

    Depends on what you mean by origins. Do you mean the philosophy or the name?
  5. Mac

    Mac Moderator Premium Member

    I don't think I could ever get behind the idea that the Knights Templar founded Freemasonry or influenced its development. There just isn't evidence to support it. I'm open-minded, but the difference between a crackpot theory on the History Channel and something published in a peer-reviewed journal is simple: evidence.
  6. jwhoff

    jwhoff Premium Member

    Wonder who ever came up with that name ... History Channel!

  7. Frater Cliff Porter

    Frater Cliff Porter Premium Member

    I am honestly not certain if we will ever truly know the origins. One thing is for certain, whatever Freemasonry was or came from, it was heavily influenced at the Enlightenment Era in Europe and from that we find the many of the origins of our common practices.
  8. rhitland

    rhitland Founding Member Premium Member

    well heck, there goes my theory that the silent G was a clue to some mystical link to masonry. ;)
  9. Ecossais

    Ecossais Registered User

    It is hard for anyone to argue with the facts. Shortly after William Schaw, Master of Works for Scotland's King James VI, issued the Schaw Statutes to Scotland's operative lodges in 1598 and 1599, things began to change. Almost immediately, we begin to see non-operatives being "accepted" among the members of Scotland's lodges. By 1630, they had developed "the Mason Word," and there is no record of it prior to that. In 1646, we see the first record of accepted (non-operative) Masons in an English lodge. Prior to that, there is no record of accepted Masons in English lodges, so it appears that speculative Freemasonry is coming into England from Scotland about this time period.

    Further, there is no evidence of speculative Freemasonry in England prior to that 1646 record. And, there are no minute books, and no official lodge records from any English lodges prior to 1716-17. However, there are many, many minute books from Scottish lodges dating from the late 1500s and 1600s.

    In other words, there is a mountain of evidence that speculative Freemasonry began with the operative lodges of Scotland in the very late 1500s and early 1600s. But, there is no evidence that it even existed in England prior to the mid-1600s.
  10. Ecossais

    Ecossais Registered User

    BTW: Issues of historical fact are not decided by a popular vote taken by those interested in casting a vote. What if the question was asked: Who was the most influential American Masonic ritualist of the 18th century? And what if the majority "voted" for Ben Franklin? Would that make it so? In questions of historical fact, the majority can be, and often are, dead wrong.
  11. Bro. WattzPHA

    Bro. WattzPHA Registered User

    There is no set origin of Masonry but an accumulation of many origins. But it is certain that it started well before the time of Christ. Especially the rituals. They represent something far greater than infancy, manhood and old age.

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  12. James F Jackson

    James F Jackson Registered User

    Yes Sir

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  13. krafox

    krafox Registered User

    For this question i recommend two things. The book of hiran (i think that is the name in english) or a documentary called the Scotthish Key.

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  14. BroBook

    BroBook Premium Member

    Good stuff ! Thanks my brother!

    My Freemasonry HD
  15. BryanMaloney

    BryanMaloney Premium Member

    Because it's a lot easier to tell the wife "I was down at the lodge with my brothers." than "I was down at the tavern with the guys."
  16. BroBook

    BroBook Premium Member

    I am currently reading "The History of
    Freemasonry " the legendary origins by Albert Mackey

    Bro Book
  17. Warrior1256

    Warrior1256 Site Benefactor

    Very good point!
  18. masson

    masson Registered User

    I wish we were I lodge... Haha no religion no politics

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