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Grand Lodge of Georgia Bans Gay Men

Glen Cook

G A Cook
Site Benefactor
All of the others prohibited from joining are anciently recognized landmarks of Freemasonry. This prohibition bothers me so much because:

a. In the US this is a hotly debated political issue,
b. The GL has no business banning this, oddly enough it makes part of the MM obligation easier to obey for gay men,
c. Masonry is declining and GL's in the USA are scrambling to "fix" this "problem". This goes against what most young people believe and will be a turn off for them. (FYI pun intended)

a. So, we should only make our membership restrictions based on what the public in our country wishes?
b. What rule indicates a GL may not ban this, particularly when we allow only Christian GL's. All Obs are not the same. Utah prohibits inappropriate acts with a Master Mason's children since 2009.
 

GKA

Premium Member
I find it very disturbing that certain acts which most people would never consider doing have to be specifically regulated
Does anyone else see this as disturbing ?
 

Joaben

Registered User
Which "moral law" applies to freemasons? The charia, torah, inquisition, or The ethic values, human rights, constitution act? And more relevant The constant values or freemasons : fraternity, freedom, equality, uprightness?
And sexist or homophobic discrimination ? Should not it be offense againt "moral law?
 

coachn

Coach John S. Nagy
Premium Member
Which "moral law" applies to freemasons? The charia, torah, inquisition, or The ethic values, human rights, constitution act? And more relevant The constant values or freemasons : fraternity, freedom, equality, uprightness?
And sexist or homophobic discrimination ? Should not it be offense againt "moral law?
There is but one moral law and it has two entirely different ways of being stated so that its fullness can be understood:
  1. One should treat all others as one would like all others to treat oneself.
  2. One should treat no one in any way that one would not like to treat oneself.
There exist hypocrites in positions of authority who hang their hats upon the term "moral law" as an excuse to treat others hatefully and as less than. Those who support them are equally so.

edicts_03.jpg
 

Joaben

Registered User
There is but one moral law and it has two entirely different ways of being stated so that its fullness can be understood:
  1. One should treat all others as one would like all others to treat oneself.
  2. One should treat no one in any way that one would not like to treat oneself.
There exist hypocrites in positions of authority who hang their hats upon the term "moral law" as an excuse to treat others hatefully and as less than. Those who support them are equally so.
I agree with your statement. But it is a statement.
 

goomba

Neo-Antient
Site Benefactor
a. So, we should only make our membership restrictions based on what the public in our country wishes?
b. What rule indicates a GL may not ban this, particularly when we allow only Christian GL's. All Obs are not the same. Utah prohibits inappropriate acts with a Master Mason's children since 2009.

a. No and that is not even almost what I mean. I am saying the Grand Lodge of GA took a stand on a hotly debated political issue. In my mind it would be the same as saying "All men who own guns can no longer be Masons".

b. True all obligations are not the same nor are any two grand lodges the same. There isn't a rule saying we cannot ban this. There isn't a rule saying Grand Lodges cannot ban anything. However, I see this as going against some of the core teachings of Masonry.
 
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goomba

Neo-Antient
Site Benefactor
There are two problems with that statement:

Firstly, The absence of any universally applied landmarks of the Craft. At best, at least within the mainstream US Grand Lodges, you have the standards of recognition used by the Recognition Commission for the COGNMA, but beyond that... nothing. Which is why, the GL of GA is able to say definitively (within the scope of their domain) that Masonry is a Judeau-Christian organization and their laws derive from such principles.

Secondly, even if those were landmarks, most of them aren't ancient.

EDIT: I'm not defending the GL of GA, I don't agree with it at all. But I think the better action is for us to correct our Codes at home first, and then worry about GA.

There are vast numbers of people who hold Judeau-Christian beliefs who find homosexuality is acceptable with those beliefs.

I know most of them are not ancient it's just what I've always heard them referred to.

I agree brother the grand jurisdiction I was raised in has its own set of problems. That doesn't change the fact that this topic is good to discuss. I hope none of what I've said here comes across as harsh or unloving to any of you.
 

Glen Cook

G A Cook
Site Benefactor
a. No and that is not even almost what I mean. I am saying the Grand Lodge of GA took a stand on a hotly debated political issue. In my mind it would be the same as saying "All men who own guns can no longer be Masons".

b. True all obligations are not the same nor are any two grand lodges the same. There isn't a rule saying we cannot ban this. There isn't a rule saying Grand Lodges cannot ban anything. However, I see this as going against some of the core teachings of Masonry.
a. So, if an issue is hotly debated by the public, we may not take a stand? Where do you find this rule?
b. What are these core teachings and where do you find them?
 

Glen Cook

G A Cook
Site Benefactor
Which "moral law" applies to freemasons? The charia, torah, inquisition, or The ethic values, human rights, constitution act? And more relevant The constant values or freemasons : fraternity, freedom, equality, uprightness?
And sexist or homophobic discrimination ? Should not it be offense againt "moral law?
So, you believe women and non-believers should be members of the Fraternity?
 

coachn

Coach John S. Nagy
Premium Member
So, you believe women and non-believers should be members of the Fraternity?
<cough> Well, actually.... they are members of the Fraternity; just not ones that "our" specific Fraternity Recognizes. But, that's a whole different nut to crack.
 
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Glen Cook

G A Cook
Site Benefactor
<cough> Well, actually.... they are members of the Fraternity; just not ones that "our" specific Fraternity Recognizes. But, that's a whole different nut to crack.
Well, you are quite correct. I shall clarify CGMNA and Home GL recognized Freemasonry.
 

Joaben

Registered User
So, you believe women and non-believers should be members of the Fraternity?
1 :The main question is why should You exclude them from Fm?
2 : no-sexism is widely practiced in FM. For The Benefice of all.
3 : Fm is it a matter of believing ? In Europe, 70% of FM are non-believers!
 

Joaben

Registered User
<cough> Well, actually.... they are members of the Fraternity; just not ones that "our" specific Fraternity Recognizes. But, that's a whole different nut to crack.
If we follow our rituals there is ONE Universal fraternity. Multiples fraternity is ... Somthing else which has to do with human conventions, not fm.
Fm is ONE people governed by the same rules.
 

coachn

Coach John S. Nagy
Premium Member
1 :The main question is why should You exclude them from Fm?
The main answer is this mythical "you" doesn't. The collective GL of any jurisdiction dictates who is in and who is out. Each GL is different. Mob rules apply! Yes, it can get ugly. :(
2 : no-sexism is widely practiced in FM. For The Benefice of all.
Yup. And each jurisdiction determines this for themselves.:cool:
3 : Fm is it a matter of believing ?
For some, yes. :D
In Europe, 70% of FM are non-believers!
In "merica" it's 100% believers in all Recognized GLs and even in most unrecognized GLs. And it might very well be the reason why we're not in Europe ;).
 

coachn

Coach John S. Nagy
Premium Member
If we follow our rituals there is ONE Universal fraternity.
Is that assuming that there is actually one "ritual" for all to follow?
In reality, there are the great pontifications that everyone espouses in lodge and then there are the ugly realities that are actually practiced with great zeal.
Multiples fraternity is ... Somthing else which has to do with human conventions, not fm.
Fm is ONE people governed by the same rules.
FM is also multiple peoples mislead by untold common misunderstandings.
 

Glen Cook

G A Cook
Site Benefactor
1 :The main question is why should You exclude them from Fm?
2 : no-sexism is widely practiced in FM. For The Benefice of all.
3 : Fm is it a matter of believing ? In Europe, 70% of FM are non-believers!
Well, I'm not sure the percentage is that high, particularly if including UK, but point taken.

So, sexism in Recognized Freemasonry is ok, but no other Ism?

Are you a Freemason of any stripe?
 
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