My Freemasonry | Freemason Information and Discussion Forum

Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

Irregular Masonic Bodies Operating in Texas

towerbuilder7

Moderator
Premium Member
I appreciate that Post, Worshipful......Most John G Jones Lodges claim their "Southern and Western Masonic Jurisdiction" was established April 5, 1869, in Wash DC..........and, as you read the History, John G Jones performed MOST of the work HIMSELF; so, it stands to reason why he shoulders the majority of the blame. He travelled across State Lines, invading States, forming AF&AM Lodges and conferring Degrees without the permission of either the Mainstream GL OR the PHA GL of the affected State. he also formed a "General Grand Masonic Congress", to oversee the Symbolic Lodges, which mirrored the National Compact debacle that Prince Hall Affiliated Masonry endured in the 1840's. Hopefully, we can PROTECT Masonry, and get ALL of the Men "healed" over into a proper Masonic affiliation that contains REGULARITY AS WELL AS RECOGNITION AND LINEAGE................Bro. Jones
 

Harmon

Registered User
there is a so called mason from one of these bogus gl's that states that PHA grand lodge applied to the GL of Texas to be healed.
 

towerbuilder7

Moderator
Premium Member
Total falsehood, Sir. No need to apply to be healed if you weren't the one with a questionable lineage, and Lack of formal recognition. 237 years of history behind what we have in PHA Masonry, with an Original Charter from England for African Lodge 459, locked in a vault in Boston, Mass. John G Jones AF&AM Lodges have NO link to the UGLE, other than the fact that Jones himself is an expelled 33rd Degree Prince Hall Mason. (October 22, 1895)

Jones himself claimed to have gotten a charter from the Grand Lodge of Romania in 1869, before establishing the "Southern and Western Masonic Jurisdiction", and the "General Grand Masonic Congress" for his AF&AM subordinate Lodges and Appendant Bodies, all created by HIM. Problem is, Grand Lodge of Romania wasnt established until 1880. I would encourage you to check out the Commission on Bogus Masonry link on the Phylaxis Society website for additional information. Bro Jones
 

towerbuilder7

Moderator
Premium Member
The one Compact we have made with the GLoTx is the one for Mutual Recognition in 2007, whereby each Masonic Jurisdiction recognizes the other, agrees to maintain Mutual Exclusive Jurisdiction among their subordinate lodges, and did not permit inter visitation or Formal Masonic Discussion. Bro Jones
 

Harmon

Registered User
I am not the questioner what i did was post what someone on a FB group stated that i knew was a complete lie, and i told him he should come to this forum and let's have this discussion,

PM Harmon Weston
St. John's lodge # 29
MWPHGL of NY
 

bupton52

Moderator
Premium Member
I am not the questioner what i did was post what someone on a FB group stated that i knew was a complete lie, and i told him he should come to this forum and let's have this discussion,

PM Harmon Weston
St. John's lodge # 29
MWPHGL of NY

I know who you are talking about, and I doubt that he will even come here for that foolishness to be entertained.
 

towerbuilder7

Moderator
Premium Member
I completely understand, PM Weston. And My District Brother Upton is correct. He will not come on this site. And even if he did, I would take the high road. Again, no NEED to debate when you have 237 years of THE TRUTH on your side. All of the others have to reach and claw for any piece of an argument they can consider. I will address them with the TRUTH AND LIGHT they seek. It's up to them as to whether they will ACCEPT IT. I WAS MAN ENOUGH TO ACCEPT IT, and petitioned for Healing. The rest was history! Now, here I am!!! Bro Jones
 

towerbuilder7

Moderator
Premium Member
Anytime, Brother. If there is anything else you desire LIGHT on regarding PHA Masonry, PM me, or shoot me an email at towerbuilder7@gmail.com. Bro Jones
 

Michael Neumann

Premium Member
My wife wants to join the OES so I have been researching lately, look what I crossed: "the United Grand Lodge of England - the oldest Grand Lodge in the world and from whom the majority of recognized Grand Lodges in the world derive their heritage (some came from Ireland or Scotland) - considers the OES to be 'clandestine' and forbids the Members of the UGLE to attend meetings of the group. Is the Order of the Eastern Star 'clandestine'?" http://www.masonicinfo.com/fakemasonry.htm Has anyone crossed this before?
 

dfreybur

Premium Member
My wife wants to join the OES so I have been researching lately, look what I crossed: "the United Grand Lodge of England - the oldest Grand Lodge in the world and from whom the majority of recognized Grand Lodges in the world derive their heritage (some came from Ireland or Scotland) - considers the OES to be 'clandestine' and forbids the Members of the UGLE to attend meetings of the group. Is the Order of the Eastern Star 'clandestine'?" http://www.masonicinfo.com/fakemasonry.htm Has anyone crossed this before?

UGLE tends to not approve of appendent bodies. It looks like to them there are craft lodges and that's it. Except they're okay with some of the York Rite degrees. It doesn't quite add up the way Americans tend to see it but it is a part of a long established pattern.

As far as OES is concerned I don't think boss lady needs to be concerned about it. It's not like she's going to try to visit the UK and try to pass the tiler at a craft lodge there.
 

Scorpionlawz

Registered User
-> tower builder7. I had the exact same experience in Massachusetts. These lodges which profess to be masons, they do live by Masonic principles, but they don't enjoy all the rights and privileges of regular Masons. I had to renounce my previous affiliations, but worth it to be a part of regular masonry.


Bro. Junior A. Knight
Chicopee Lodge
GL Massachusetts
 

rfuller

Premium Member
My lodge may be potentially looking at a member of one of these clandestine lodges who wishes to be "healed". My lodge is AF&AM. At the Grand Master's conference this year they mentioned healing, but it was in the context of coming from out of state after only completing the FC degree with no demit and no way to test proficiency. They mentioned healing, so I understand there are provisions for it, but that was clearly not the case we are potentially dealing with. It seem to me the PHA have a pretty well laid out path for people in that position as Bro. Jones (towerbuilder) pointed out, but I'm not clear on how this would work in an AF&AM lodge. Any AF&AM - TX brothers have any insight on this?
 
Last edited:

dfreybur

Premium Member
Any AF&AM - TX brothers have any insight on this?

Unless the committee on ritual teaches a specific ritual for healing there is no form shorter than retaking his degrees. Learning a second set of proficiencies should be similar to learning a second ritual. He already knows he can do it and how to do it, but relearning isn't as easy as learning was in the first place (been there, done that, got that tee shirt, now relearning a third version of ritual).

My suggestion comes in the form of a rhetorical question - How generous can your lodge be about, ahem, "a foreign accent", when he delivers his proficiencies? Maybe he has "a foreign accent" and his words were blurred to the point you had trouble hearing them just right. Just sayin' that generosity in the face of "a foreign accent" might happen if you're careful about arranging it. He could end up going through his degrees pretty quickly.

When filling a chair my lodges find it humorous when bits of California ritual roll off my tongue by mistake when doing Illinois work. "Dude!" Same when I do small parts in Texas ritual and I get certain words wrong. "DA Bears!"

If he wants to go through the line he's got to learn the entire ritual over anyways. His hurdle would be earning a ritual certificate as that would entail relearning the proficiencies completely without a foreign accent.
 

rfuller

Premium Member
Unless the committee on ritual teaches a specific ritual for healing there is no form shorter than retaking his degrees.

Yeah. The WM and I talked about that last night. The brother who is in contact with him is contacting the Grand Lodge for direction. I haven't met the man. I have only heard that the brother in contact saw his ring, tried him, he passed with flying colors. They got to talking and everything was kosher until the brother asked which lodge he attended. We have 4 AF&AM lodges and 1 PHA lodge here, and his lodge wasn't any of those. The brother approached him about it, the gentleman was surprised, and decided he would like to rectify the situation by joining a regular lodge. It's certainly not a common occurrence in this medium sized town in West Texas. I'll be honest, I had no idea we had a clandestine lodge here.

I guess what I'm saying is I'm not sure about the ritual work at his lodge, but apparently the modes of recognition are the same.
 

dfreybur

Premium Member
I have only heard that the brother in contact saw his ring, tried him, he passed with flying colors ... I guess what I'm saying is I'm not sure about the ritual work at his lodge, but apparently the modes of recognition are the same.

I figure clandestine lodges use one of the published ritual books for their basis, maybe doing the usual small changes we see jurisdiction to jurisdiction. What they learn should end up nearly identical to what we learn.

If I recited my California proficiencies to you they would not be the exact same that you learned but there would be a ton of overlap. Texas first is longer than California first. California third is longer than Texas third. But as you heard it you would be clear you were hearing a proficiency.
 

Txmason32

Registered User
There was a guy who posted on Fb who was a 99* of the Egyptian rite and was starting a gl in Texas .... wow 99*

Sent From My Freemasonry Pro App
 

dfreybur

Premium Member
There was a guy who posted on Fb who was a 99* of the Egyptian rite and was starting a gl in Texas .... wow 99*

Memphis and Misriam has 99 degrees. Maybe he's a member. Maybe he just read a book about them. Making up his own grand lodge maybe he didn't even read a book about them.
 

Cblack

Registered User
Most of the clandestine GLs in TX are practicing that right..Abraham GL is the source of it

Sent from my SPH-L710 using My Freemasonry HD mobile app
 

Bro. Barnett

Registered User
I have oft heard of major issues and disdain between AF&AM and F&AM Masons and . I'm wondering is the opinion implicated here that 4 letter black Masons are clandestine? I was raised in a four letter black lodge, and we were taught to make no discrimination between any brothers whether they were Prince Hall Masons, international Masons, or 4 letter Masons. It seems that we have so much going on in the world right now that we could move past the feud of PHA versus four letter in the black community. I'm not making any accusations, I was just wondering because I've always wanted to ask my Prince Hall brethren this question...
Sincerely in the light, T. Barnett
 
Top