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Dual Lodge Membership

Ripcord22A

Site Benefactor
Yeah. There was another brother sitting next to me from my lodge and we were both looking at each other like "really? Is he gonna word for word read the minutes?"

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Warrior1256

Site Benefactor
That only applies to an unaffiliated Mason, i.e. one who does not belong to any Lodge. That's to prevent a Brother from visiting Lodges forever without paying dues anywhere.
Exactly. Here in Kentucky if you are a member of a lodge you can visit other lodges as many times as you like.
Reading the minutes???????? I can't remember the last time I heard them read.
They are read here at every meeting that I have been to.
 

Bill Lins

Moderating Staff
Staff Member
We read the minutes of meetings held since & including those of the last stated meeting @ every stated meeting but we don't spend a lot of time doing it.
 

Ripcord22A

Site Benefactor
See to me that is THE worst part of the meeting. Id rather talk about bills. At leatlst with those you can discuss ways to lower them. The only discussion on minutes is " um i believe it was brother smith not brother doe who proposed that, or um its actually Right worshipful not just worshipful...." thats why we email them out so you can go over them before the meeting and then theres only that discussion...not 20min of reading them then discussion

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Bill Lins

Moderating Staff
Staff Member
not 20min of reading them then discussion
20 MINUTES?!? Holy Cow! No wonder y'all figured something else out! If we spend 3 minutes it was quite a busy month! Of course, OUR Secretary leaves out the crap like" The Worshipful Master led the Brethren in the Pledges of Allegiance to the flags of the United States of America and the Great State of Texas." Since that's done at EVERY meeting, we see no need to include it in the minutes.
 

Bloke

Premium Member
Montezuma was the first lidge i went to here, it was a long drawn out business meeting. I picked a terrible night to vist- finance comittee report, lodge elections, and a report on the roof contractor that bamboozled the lodge...the next week i went to Cerrillos(on Scott Js invatation)-great meal, presentation no bills and what not loved the small group feel. Affiliated the next month. Still go to Montezuma from time to time and under the direction of WM DeGiovanni its getting better but this last meeting the first 30min was the reading of 3 sets of minutes. At cerrillos the minutes are emailed out to all the members a few days prior for our review, then if need be are discussed and accepted as emailed or ammended...also our bylaws allow for the secretary to just pay bills. The meetings are always worthwhile.

There is a simple message in the above. JD, visited a lodge which had drawn out business and another lodge which did not - which lodge did he join ?

I'm always shocked when I go to a lodge a hear the minutes read. As WM, if they have not been circulated via email for some reason, unless there is something VERY critical (like confirmation of a vote), I have them put aside until next meeting. We can do that, or more to the point, there is nothing saying the minutes from the last meeting must be presented at the next. I am not going to let some sec (even a good one) burn our time because he has not got around to circulating the minutes...
 

Bill Lins

Moderating Staff
Staff Member
I'm always shocked when I go to a lodge a hear the minutes read.
As you can see below, we are required under GLoTX Law to read the minutes of previous meetings at our stated meetings. As over half of our membership doesn't do email, there's no point in sending the minutes to those who do- we'd still have to read them regardless. As the requirement to read them is listed first in the Order of Business, I take it that they're serious about it.

Art. 333. Order of Business. At stated meetings after opening of the Lodge in due and ancient form, a quorum being present, the Order of Business, unless otherwise ordered by the Lodge or the Worshipful Master, shall be as follows:
1. Reading, correcting and approval of Minutes of previous meetings.
 

Bloke

Premium Member
As you can see below, we are required under GLoTX Law to read the minutes of previous meetings at our stated meetings. As over half of our membership doesn't do email, there's no point in sending the minutes to those who do- we'd still have to read them regardless. As the requirement to read them is listed first in the Order of Business, I take it that they're serious about it.

Art. 333. Order of Business. At stated meetings after opening of the Lodge in due and ancient form, a quorum being present, the Order of Business, unless otherwise ordered by the Lodge or the Worshipful Master, shall be as follows:
1. Reading, correcting and approval of Minutes of previous meetings.

The order of business, unless otherwise ordered... hmm.. as WM I would give a order that the minutes be circulated by email or by post where necessary and taken as read. On my summons I'd have "Minutes". In in the minutes we would record "The minutes as circulated were adopted"

.....As over half of our membership doesn't do email, there's no point in sending the minutes to those who do- we'd still have to read them regardless......

Does that mean you have to post your summons ? Expensive.... and very wasteful....

People used to say that here... in a lodge of 40, we only have 3 without email.. we've lost a few older members in recent years, but every one of them had email. In my other lodge of about 45 - there is only one member without email. It is amazing how quickly people who "do not have email" will give you none when you explain it is costing the lodge $x to send it out OR a recent departure of a young brother(s) was because they didn't join Freemasonry to hear minutes and we can easily remove one obstacle in our way to success by you giving me an email address... Incentivize them in some way; 100 members x 50 cents = $50 x 11 meetings = $550 you could give to charity. 2 mins every meeting x 11 meetings = a 22 minute lecture on masonic education. It's boring... etc etc You need to look for the right levers to change this. I'm 44 year old. Nothing upsets me more than folk wasting my time. Every lodge renewal program says they same, don't waste members time on minutes... If my GL made me read minutes I'd have a motion in there so fast my head would spin.... but I would test rule 333 above, but you would need the support of the members to do that....

I hope your secretary reads at breakneck speed. Our business is already bad enough without adding such a useless waste of time to it... It also does not allow members to consider the minutes or have a personal record of what went on.

God. Sorry to say, but thank the GAOTU I am no longer subjected to Sec's reading minutes, reading minutes basically died out about 10 years ago here, and the lodges which kept reading their minutes tend to die.

Darwinism is not survival of the fittest, it's survival of the most adaptable and adapting means change...

(you have no idea how the idea of listening to minutes has got my goat LOL).
 

dfreybur

Premium Member
20 MINUTES?!? Holy Cow! No wonder y'all figured something else out! If we spend 3 minutes it was quite a busy month!

It only seems to take 3+ minutes if the Secretary was out sick the month before and there were several degrees in the previous two month. If it's taking 20 minutes to read the events of one previous month you'd better have discussed the three different offers that were received to buy your lodge building and its land! (Been there, done that, got that tee shirt).

Of course, OUR Secretary leaves out the crap like" The Worshipful Master led the Brethren in the Pledges of Allegiance to the flags of the United States of America and the Great State of Texas." Since that's done at EVERY meeting, we see no need to include it in the minutes.

It's not like I'm ever going to take up arms against Texas even if there's a revolution of some sort but I still find the double pledge strange.

Sort of like when there was an Order of Amaranth meeting in the room next to my mother lodge and the played both the Star Spangled Banner and O Canada on their piano to start their meetings. In Los Angeles metro. Kind of far from the Canadian border to get to that particular building.
 

Bill Lins

Moderating Staff
Staff Member
The order of business, unless otherwise ordered... hmm.. as WM I would give a order that the minutes be circulated by email or by post where necessary and taken as read. On my summons I'd have "Minutes". In in the minutes we would record "The minutes as circulated were adopted"

You just might get tarred & feathered if you tried that here. Masters (and prospective Masters) need to keep foremost in their minds that they hold their positions in order to serve the Craft, not order them around. Much better to find out what the members desire and provide it.

Does that mean you have to post your summons ? Expensive.... and very wasteful....

No- the only time "summons" are sent are in the event of a special emergency called meeting. In the 17 years I've been in the Lodge, we've never had one. I send out an agenda by email for each meeting & in the event of something out of the ordinary, I call those Brethren who don't have email & advise them of the circumstances.

I hope your secretary reads at breakneck speed.

Not really. I ARE the Secretary and it rarely, if ever, takes more than a couple of minutes to get through them unless discussion is desired, such as in the case of unfinished business.
 

Bloke

Premium Member
Hi Bro Sec Bill :)

You just might get tarred & feathered if you tried that here. Masters (and prospective Masters) need to keep foremost in their minds that they hold their positions in order to serve the Craft, not order them around. Much better to find out what the members desire and provide it.

I agree. It's the same here. I've seen members boycott a lodge for a year because of a bossy master... If you do not have the respect of your members you can't do anything meaningful nor bring the team together... If you try to be autocratic, you'll generally get no where. I know, I've done things like get my lodge to permanently change the night it has met since foundation, it took 2 minutes in lodge to do, and only because the "Old Statesmen" of the lodge stood up to say how wonderful it was. Those 2 minutes took months to set up.... I used the word "order" in the sense of exploiting the wording in the Const to avoid having the minutes read.. I think you could legitimately take them as read if the members had got a copy before...

That said, I've seen those sitting in the East give orders in the true sense, I've given them, and I had to follow them, and willingly. The trick having a master with social capital and good clear goals which allow him to do such a thing when needed... but it is very rare and better to say "decision" or "determination" rather than order...

At the end of the day, a Master is actually the *real* Head Steward of the lodge, there to serve, anticipate problems, shepherd the lodge and create the conditions towards success.

Serving the craft does not mean being a lemming, and many GL's and PMs sometimes expect that..... just like being a Master or GM does not make you God... at the end of the day, you're leading volunteers, do a bad job and they will walk (or they might stay and be the last members your lodge ever has LOL). If you want to know how to run a lodge well, my advice is ask a successful combat infantry commander who's been in the hot zone for a while but also served as a staff officer and done well in both rolls; they always give the best education on how to lead a lodge..
 

acjohnson53

Registered User
What's the purpose of dual membership?You getting the same stuff. Don't make know sense to be a member of two different Blue Lodges???
 

Bloke

Premium Member
What's the purpose of dual membership?You getting the same stuff. Don't make know sense to be a member of two different Blue Lodges???

When I was a MM, esp a deacon, I got to act in more than once lodge at once - which really skilled me up. At the moment, I am ADC (assist director of ceremonies) in two lodge which again is skilling me up (although I've ended up acting as DC in one).

Double meetings. Double rehearsal. Two sets of PMs to learn from. Two sets of leadership teams to observe.... two sets of friends - being in two lodges has been great for me.... and I think I've been able to make great contributions in both.

Shortly after taking JD, I've always been involved in other lodges... supporting one for years as IG because they needed me, being a honourary member in another and not taking office but filling any gap (except chaplain because I've never learned the work..which is a bit naughty because I should know it)...

I decline offers of honourary membership nowdays. Two lodges have chased me already this year - mainly again because of the skills I strengthened being a member of two lodges, but now I make them my main focus and only have couple of other lodges I regularly put my hand up to do work in...
 

Derinique Kendrick

Registered User
Double meetings. Double rehearsal. Two sets of PMs to learn from. Two sets of leadership teams to observe.... two sets of friends - being in two lodges has been great for me.... and I think I've been able to make great contributions in both.
Great way to put it! Definitely a way to increase learning and gain more friends.
 

dfreybur

Premium Member
You've been here long enough to have learned that Texans don't much care what you furriners consider strange. :D

Exactly. Of course the feeling is mutual and friendly.

I don't consider strange to equal bad. I'm aware that humans are herd animals so most want to be in the middle of the herd, but in some particular or another all of us are unlike the herd enough to be strange at something.
 
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