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Decline in Freemasonry

dfreybur

Premium Member
I like to think there's a reason for everything, even if it isn't obvious. I like to think the "no invitation" policy encourages us to be more as lodges and individuals so that we attract men to us.

History matters. What's the history of when and why we went to invitations? Be sure your answer takes into account those jurisdictions that never changed away from being by invitation. Which is to say be sure your answer includes that we were founded as an invitational organization.

The surface history is that operative lodges started inviting eminent men to join them and that's how we became speculative. Which states that even in the operative days we'd been invitational and the change hadn't been about invitations.

Switching away from invitations is like the switch away from having toasts at our meals. Not a part of the original design of the order.
 

LK600

Premium Member
I'm interested in the mystical but I knew when I petitioned that not one in a thousand shared my interest.

I wonder if this has or is changing? It seems from my limited exposure newer members are more inclined to be drawn to the esoteric but refrain from discussing it with older members. Anyway, I must set aside the speculative side and practice the operative... need to go bust up some rocks and pour some cement. ;)
 

CLewey44

Registered User
You petitioned a group run by a generation that wanted to give service. Guess who's duty it is to cause the evolution you want? Be the change you want in the world.

I'm interested in the mystical but I knew when I petitioned that not one in a thousand shared my interest.
This is true. I feel pretty comfortable that I am doing what I can at this time to change that.
 

Warrior1256

Site Benefactor
The surface history is that operative lodges started inviting eminent men to join them and that's how we became speculative. Which states that even in the operative days we'd been invitational and the change hadn't been about invitations.

Switching away from invitations is like the switch away from having toasts at our meals. Not a part of the original design of the order.
Good point!
I feel pretty comfortable that I am doing what I can at this time to change that.
Great. I'm also trying to attract new, younger members. Hopefully will have a couple of them petitioning soon.
 

dfreybur

Premium Member
I wonder if this has or is changing? It seems from my limited exposure newer members are more inclined to be drawn to the esoteric but refrain from discussing it with older members.

It is changing, but as far as the mystical not a lot. Now maybe one in a hundred. Lots of young men are coming in looking for values, philosophy, history, life balance and similar topics. Only a tiny number for the mysticism. Way more than in previous generations though.

The word esoteric has to be used with care. In lodge it means the memorized ritual work. That's a very different meaning than how it's used outside of lodge.

I think in my first decade as a mason I encountered one Brother interested in mysticism, of course a different branch than my interests. I spent the evening in discussion with him ignoring dinner and visiting Masonic dignitaries.

Now it's some easier but we're still thin on the ground. I was at a district event and there was a young visitor. I saw him doodling in a notebook and noticed he was free associating on a mystical topic. After the meeting I mentioned that the due guards and signs appear to be chakra activations. He opened his notebook to a color coded chakra chart. We spent hours sitting on a staircase discussing the topic.
 

LK600

Premium Member
It is changing, but as far as the mystical not a lot. Now maybe one in a hundred. Lots of young men are coming in looking for values, philosophy, history, life balance and similar topics. Only a tiny number for the mysticism. Way more than in previous generations though.

The word esoteric has to be used with care. In lodge it means the memorized ritual work. That's a very different meaning than how it's used outside of lodge.

I think in my first decade as a mason I encountered one Brother interested in mysticism, of course a different branch than my interests. I spent the evening in discussion with him ignoring dinner and visiting Masonic dignitaries.

Now it's some easier but we're still thin on the ground. I was at a district event and there was a young visitor. I saw him doodling in a notebook and noticed he was free associating on a mystical topic. After the meeting I mentioned that the due guards and signs appear to be chakra activations. He opened his notebook to a color coded chakra chart. We spent hours sitting on a staircase discussing the topic.

I hope it continues to change. It is (one of) an area I have high interest in.
 

billyjfootball

Registered User
And how exactly did it do this? Please, be specific.

For me it opened my eyes. We only have so much time on this planet. I try to stay within myself and not get carried away with things. It has taught me patience. It has taught me how I ought to divide my day. It has taught me to be better to others. Just being a Mason makes me feel like I ought to be a role model in society. May sound crazy, it has also made me a better driver. I have the Square and compasses on my car, so I'm very cautious of all driving laws now. Don't want anybody to get mad about my driving and think about the Masons in a bad light. Lastly, It helped me become a leader.


Sent from my iPhone using My Freemason
 

hanzosbm

Premium Member
I don't get the leap of illogic here. The entire point of extending invitations is to invite the best and brightest.
Correction; that's YOUR point of extending invitations. But there's two problems here.
First, the lodges that I mentioned in my original post that are slamming through 10 candidates a week are clearly not looking for the best and brightest, they're looking for warm bodies. Do you think that will somehow change when they can invite people? Instead of slamming through 10 a week, it'll be 30 per week.
Second, just because some is 'the best and brightest' doesn't mean that they'll make a good Mason. And before someone jumps in and says 'well we'd only invite the men who would make good Masons', the point is, if they didn't have any interest in it to begin with, what makes you think they'll be a good Mason?
 

dfreybur

Premium Member
Correction; that's YOUR point of extending invitations.

That's the original intent centuries ago before the switch away from being invitational only.

Instead of slamming through 10 a week, it'll be 30 per week

You assume that doing invitations would increase petitions from the outside. Maybe. Maybe not.

I do see some lodges doing a lot of degrees. My Shrine gives awards for any Shriner who is the top line signer for 10+ new Shriners or another line signer for 20+ new Shriners or any combination. Do that type of award with blue lodge degrees and the problem you describe results.
 

CLewey44

Registered User
I don't know any lodge that does 10 EAs a week, I think too that people could decline any invitations. As a matter of fact, I think it could lessen petitions since the fraternity would have more control on who they even bother with voting on, ent, psg and rsg.
 

Bloke

Premium Member
I don't know any lodge that does 10 EAs a week, I think too that people could decline any invitations. As a matter of fact, I think it could lessen petitions since the fraternity would have more control on who they even bother with voting on, ent, psg and rsg.
My lodges would all decline to do 10 EAs in a year. Once you make them, they need mentoring.. I think the sweet spot (of us meeting monthly) is about 3 candidates per year.
 

Bloke

Premium Member
...The word esoteric has to be used with care. In lodge it means the memorized ritual work. That's a very different meaning than how it's used outside of lodge...

I am not sure I agree Bro Doug. I think "esoteric" always means " intended for or likely to be understood by only a small number of people with a specialized knowledge or interest."... The key is specialized knowledge. We have some esoteric charges, for instance Ecclesiastes - a charge best understood with esoteric knowledge where you understand the analogies. But even "sitting in the East" is esoteric - on the initial level, it means a direction, on a deeper esoteric level, it has something to do with knowledge and understanding - which we esoterically call "light". Far from being "memorized work" I think in a lodge "esoteric" is talking about how you, and especially we, interpret and understand that work, and the nomenclature of Freemasonry, especially the collective use of shared interpretations.
 

coachn

Coach John S. Nagy
Premium Member
I am not sure I agree Bro Doug. I think "esoteric" always means " intended for or likely to be understood by only a small number of people with a specialized knowledge or interest."... The key is specialized knowledge. We have some esoteric charges, for instance Ecclesiastes - a charge best understood with esoteric knowledge where you understand the analogies. But even "sitting in the East" is esoteric - on the initial level, it means a direction, on a deeper esoteric level, it has something to do with knowledge and understanding - which we esoterically call "light". Far from being "memorized work" I think in a lodge "esoteric" is talking about how you, and especially we, interpret and understand that work, and the nomenclature of Freemasonry, especially the collective use of shared interpretations.
We must have a schism then. The word has a specific meaning in my jurisdiction and it refers solely to the lettered and masked portion of our ritual. Which is most likely why we get such weird looks from those who don't define it this way.
 

Bloke

Premium Member
We must have a schism then. The word has a specific meaning in my jurisdiction and it refers solely to the lettered and masked portion of our ritual. Which is most likely why we get such weird looks from those who don't define it this way.
Inter-rest-ing.

Thanks Coach - I was not aware... is that widespread in the USA ?
 

dfreybur

Premium Member
Inter-rest-ing.

Thanks Coach - I was not aware... is that widespread in the USA ?

All 3 of my jurisdictions have a local definition of the word esoteric to mean that part of the ritual not to be shared except at a degree or with a Brother of that degree. Plus 1 more jurisdiction where I lived long enough to affiliate but not long enough to pay for a life/endowed membership. Plus any jurisdictions that I visited enough to learn their local usage.

Exoteric - That part of the ritual that is allowed to be shared with those not of that degree. Some jurisdictions list the Monitor as exoteric, others don't.

Esoteric - That part of the ritual only to be performed in degrees or as practice with Brothers of that degree. Typically available in cipher.

These official local definitions definitely confuse the issue of what is and isn't esoteric. But it does let us discuss the types of secrets that remain secret even if we shout them from the roof tops - We treat each other as family. There is no method; we just do it.

In fact this local definition of esoteric is why we are allowed to discuss what the ritual means to us as long as we don't quote the words we reference.
 

Bloke

Premium Member
All 3 of my jurisdictions have a local definition of the word esoteric to mean that part of the ritual not to be shared except at a degree or with a Brother of that degree. Plus 1 more jurisdiction where I lived long enough to affiliate but not long enough to pay for a life/endowed membership. Plus any jurisdictions that I visited enough to learn their local usage.

Exoteric - That part of the ritual that is allowed to be shared with those not of that degree. Some jurisdictions list the Monitor as exoteric, others don't.

Esoteric - That part of the ritual only to be performed in degrees or as practice with Brothers of that degree. Typically available in cipher.

These official local definitions definitely confuse the issue of what is and isn't esoteric. But it does let us discuss the types of secrets that remain secret even if we shout them from the roof tops - We treat each other as family. There is no method; we just do it.

In fact this local definition of esoteric is why we are allowed to discuss what the ritual means to us as long as we don't quote the words we reference.
Thanks - that's something I did not know; that the word is defined like that. We use in to refer to the deeper meaning of the words and symbols we use..
 
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