What if.....

[owls84]

Ok this is a hypothetical question to learn just how far the law can be intrepreted.

So I am WM and I have opened a ballot for the purpose of electing a candidate fo receive the degrees. It is very apparant that there are shinanigans involved and there are some issues in the lodge where some members don't like what is going on and decided to black ball all candidates. Just what are my abilities as Master? I know I can kick it back many times but the other day I was looking at a few things. Could I stop balloting call the craft from refreshment then vote at another time and then finish the stated meeting at that same time? I could not find where it says the Stated Meeting could not be held over or called from refreshment. I did not see where it said the stated meeting had to be closed on the day it was opened.

Now keep in mind I know that this is no atmosphere to bring a new mason into but sometimes it is good just to know what your options are. What all can I do besides keep voting? Make sure you prove your answer with GL Law or other.

 

[nick1368]

well it will be interesting to see how this one plays out....

 

[TCShelton]

However you approach this, bear in mind that the guy can still get protested even after balloting.

 

[owls84]

However you approach this, bear in mind that the guy can still get protested even after balloting.

Yeah, I figured that but I sometines feel that some people may flex not knowing what their options are other than complaining and balloting. I know in some instances the opposition is aware of their rights as a MM but it would be nice to know ALL the options one has if ever faced with this decision. That way we know, and knowing is half the battle.

 

[Wingnut]

bump....

Dont want to lose this but need to spend some time on an answer...

 

[cambridgemason]

check your GL constitutions first, some like Massachusetts have a particular rulings whence it comes to ballots, here, once you declare the ballot open, nothing can stop the process, except maybe a fire and even that is not listed as a cause to stop. I believe you can read the application, and ask for a report from the investigation committee but as Master you can stop at that point. Had a problem years ago in a Lodge I was a member and what they did was not even read his name off or the investigation committee. The Master postponed that particular candidates ballot til that candidate withdraw it.

 

[js4253]

I can't quote the law but I think that Lodge is automatically closed at midnight.

 

[TCShelton]

I can't quote the law but I think that Lodge is automatically closed at midnight.

You are correct.

 

[rhitland]

Could I stop balloting call the craft from refreshment then vote at another time and then finish the stated meeting at that same time?

A stated meeting can be called to refreshment anytime for as long as needed within the midnight parameter. I have even heard of a Master the went to refreshment and everbody left the lodge to eat and the Master and 2 wardens snuck back down called to labor and voted on petitions and then went back to refreshment and ate then came back to finish bus. it did cause a stink but in the end the WM won that battle.

 

[Bill Lins]

I can't quote the law but I think that Lodge is automatically closed at midnight.

Please furnish the cite on this. I know that a meeting held on Saturday night automatically terminates at midnight, but I have not found anything stating such for meetings on other nights.

 

[owls84]

Please furnish the cite on this. I know that a meeting held on Saturday night automatically terminates at midnight, but I have not found anything stating such for meetings on other nights.

Same here. I have looked because I thought I saw this same thing but I can't find it anymore. I just ran a search on the term "midnight" on the pdf version I have of the laws and the only places it shows midnight is in the instalations as far as midnight on June 23 and midnight on the last day of July. Thats it.

I will post a PDF of the laws on here in a bit.

 

[rhitland]

How did you go about ordering your copy in PDF format? I have a hard copy but I would also like a PDF copy to put on my Black Berry.

You just order them from GL, it may be on the website as far as price but if not call GL and they will tell you.

 

[js4253]

Same here. I have looked because I thought I saw this same thing but I can't find it anymore. I just ran a search on the term "midnight" on the pdf version I have of the laws and the only places it shows midnight is in the instalations as far as midnight on June 23 and midnight on the last day of July. Thats it.

I will post a PDF of the laws on here in a bit.

Josh, I did the same search using your PDF. I could not find any mention of lodge automatically closing at midnight. MY BAD.

 

[js4253]

How did you go about ordering your copy in PDF format? I have a hard copy but I would also like a PDF copy to put on my Black Berry.

Once it is downloaded just go to file, save and you have it.

 

[rhitland]

Just send a donation to GL like I will someday.

 

[owls84]

Once it is downloaded just go to file, save and you have it.

Yes you could do this but the reason I posted it on here is to show everyone how easy the digital copy is search and look for topics. It is still being sold by GL and I don't know how they feel about sharing their copies. I would like for you to, if you like it, to purchase it. It is not that expensive and it does help GL.

 

[owls84]

Back to the Question, now that everyone has a GLofTX Law Book. What stops a WM from calling a stated meeting to refreshment only to be opened up at a later date when trouble makers will not be there? All I am trying to do is bend those rules and be creative.

 

[TCShelton]

Forward that question to the Grand Secretary. He'll set it straight.

 

[js4253]

Back to the Question, now that everyone has a GLofTX Law Book. What stops a WM from calling a stated meeting to refreshment only to be opened up at a later date when trouble makers will not be there? All I am trying to do is bend those rules and be creative.

I understand your scenario but ask yourself this; who is more unmasonic, the trouble makers or the WM who tries to keep them from voting?

 

[Bill Lins]

I can find nothing in either the GLoT Law or the GM's Decisions which speaks to your question. GM's Decision 2005-5 addresses the question of whether a WM may refuse to allow a Lodge to vote on a motion made & seconded in open Lodge. The GM held that a WM may do so if, in his opinion, the Lodge would violate GL law by voting. He further held that the Brethren, under Art. 283, may appeal the WM's actions to the Grand Lodge.

In reference to the GLoT Law on CD, it would be even more useful if the GM's Decisions were incorporated with it and kept current.