Freemasonry needs to ditch 1950s attitudes

[Bloke]

I think to consider admitting women to address a failing membership is very faulted - one of the great things about is that if offers a rare healthy male space in the modern world and that's extremely valuable. Some confuse that with misogyny, but we know much better and how important women are to Freemasonry. Last night at the Shrine, the secretary's wife was working just as hard as he was to organise food and raffles and general admin matters.

.. since female Masonry is irregular and / or clandestine I don't bother with thinking about whether it is valid or not.

Understand. And a great point. I guess I just feel its disrespectful to keep putting female freemasonry down because it does not comply with what our idea of "Freemasonry" is. Not saying you are doing that Brother Warrior, just that I hear it too often. Many once said that about our Prince Hall Brothers but perhaps more simularly, it's like saying your Christian Church is worthless because it is not my Church. I think organisations like the Honourable Order of Women Freemasons deserve our respect, even if we would object to sitting in a tyler lodge with them (as they would us).

Which landmarks would those be? Mackey? Pound? Whatever list a particular GL makes up?

I wholeheartedly agree, but is there any traditional "regular" list which does not mention Freemasonry as a Fraternity which admits men only ? Is there any GL which decided to admit women and lost or was unable to obtain recognition from UGLE is which is often seen as the Gold Standard for recognition ?

..As to belief in Deity, I would not confuse feminine Freemasonry and coed Freemasonry

An very important point.

Female Freemasonry is clearly irregular, but that does not make it an invalid. Its a strong and proud tradition.

Let's also remember the blog I posted is the thoughts of one Brother and not an official position.

Just as the original writer and Bro Jones says, bullying is bad. Bad for men, bad for lodges and just bad !

None thing's for sure,

 

[Warrior1256]

Not saying you are doing that Brother Warrior, just that I hear it too often.

I totally understand. We simply view this matter differently. We can disagree without being disagreeable, lol.

 

[Bloke]

I totally understand. We simply view this matter differently. We can disagree without being disagreeable, lol.

Indeed my Friend and Brother

We learn nothing if we're just in an echo chamber hearing back what we already believe.

 

[Warrior1256]

We learn nothing if we're just in an echo chamber hearing back what we already believe.

Exactly!

 

[LK600]

Personally, I see no need to admit women to a Fraternal organization. If I wanted that, I have dozen's upon dozen's of other co-ed organizations to go to. I do not mind (not that it matters if I did) if other's who are NOT our Freemasonry make up their own, as long as they do not portray themselves as us. There seems to be a small but persistent effort by a small number of people to push this agenda for whatever reason. I will never agree to it and that's all she wrote on that subject.

What's that old saying... Remember, you are not required to set yourself on fire to keep other people warm.

 

[Ripcord22A]

I don't know what that is. ....

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[JJones]

>I see no need to admit women to a Fraternal organization

What then is the function of the FPoF?

I don't see how the FPOF are relevant?

 

[Ripcord22A]

I don't know what that is. ....

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Disregard I figured it out and I’m with JJones......don’t see their relevance here


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[Warrior1256]

There seems to be a small but persistent effort by a small number of people to push this agenda for whatever reason. I will never agree to it and that's all she wrote on that subject.

Spot on! We have absolutely nothing to feel guilty about because we want to remain a men only organization!

 

[CLewey44]

>I see no need to admit women to a Fraternal organization

What then is the function of the FPoF?

You tell us....

 

[Ripcord22A]

No I can’t.....please tell me. You always do this James....you come in and comment with some veiled comment and ask us the meaning but never give your thoughts
You always answer with more veil..... so please finally answer with out the Veil of James


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[CLewey44]

>You tell us....

There you have an important remanent of the ancient mysteries. Its inner function is quite different from that of the Triple Grip even though they look very similar.

Here is one of the earliest depictions - the founders of China with S&C, Sun, Moon and stars and 10 planets!

You can deduce the nature of the FPoF from that.

I feel you, I do. But this is likely less about FPoF than it is likely more about the Kaballah and Tree of Life. I see basically no f2f... k2k; maybe.... cst2cst not really at all....mt2e or ck2ck not at all. As for the 10 planets and two individuals, to me this represents more duality/fem or masc/good or evil, geburah/chesed, severity/mercy etc, 10 sephiroths, I also count (questionably, I counted them no less than a dozen times and got something different nearly everytime!) 72 'planets' and this is likely in reference to Jacob's Ladder among other things.

As for females in Masonry, are you saying we should allow them for duality purposes or we should NOT allow them to join because the cst2cst part might be a bit awkward?

EDIT My apologies, hd2bk I don' see either but more sharing of shoulders due to being conjoined...

 

[JJones]

You can deduce the nature of the FPoF from that.

*facepalm*

You're doing that thing again, James.

You always answer with more veil..... so please finally answer with out the Veil of James

It's more like a rabbit hole.

Are you suggesting that we should allow women into the fraternity because of the duality of nature?

 

[CLewey44]

>You always answer with more veil.

There is a reason that the remaining genuine secrets are veiled. What might that be?

........love ya James

 

[Warrior1256]

No I can’t.....please tell me. You always do this James....you come in and comment with some veiled comment and ask us the meaning but never give your thoughts
You always answer with more veil..... so please finally answer with out the Veil of James

You're doing that thing again, James.

AGREED!!!!!

 

[Ripcord22A]

>You always answer with more veil.

There is a reason that the remaining genuine secrets are veiled. What might that be?

You are bordering on troll status James. ....remember resam. ....yeah..like him

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[CLewey44]

What does 'Even Clint Lewey compares an artist's impression done perhaps 10 000 years after the event with his local ritual where the genuine secrets have not been seen for 300 years." mean? I'm trying to clarify what you are saying. Some 10, 000 year old ancient Asian art has little or nothing directly to do with BL Masonry. Does it all connect together in some way shape or form? Perhaps, but it's not that obvious and you'd really have to dig to link it accurately. I am familiar with Astrotheology and how things link together. Believe me, I understand what you mean but this site may not be the best forum to talk down to my Brothers on. I appreciate your insight sometimes but this may not be the best place for that.

 

[Ripcord22A]

When I give data points they are completely ignored. Even Clint Lewey compares an artist's impression done perhaps 10 000 years after the event with his local ritual where the genuine secrets have not been seen for 300 years.

Current ritual has been modified by >10 generations of brethren without the genuine secrets. How good is that?

Given the parlous state of Masonic knowledge, recovery of the genuine secrets (from the ancient mysteries) must start outside of Masonry with wide reading, meditation and pursuit of the hidden mysteries of nature and science.

John 6:60

There are NO “genuine” secrets. The word secret means “not known or seen or not meant to be known or seen by others.” So if there’s a secret that is outside the fraternity you can’t know it unless it is told to you. Same as our “secrets”. Which aren’t really secret at all and never have been. Freemasonry is an organization that someone made up 300ish yrs ago and used stories from many cultures and mashed em together to tell a story.

Spoiler alert: HAB wasn’t the chief architect.
Moses didn’t part the Red Sea and Mohamed didn’t speak directly to God.

 

[CLewey44]

>I'm trying to clarify what you are saying.

Neither source is accurate but both serve as a starting point for inquiry into some of the genuine secrets.

>this may not be the best place for that.

Quite so. Do you have a better suggestion?

Google

 

[Warrior1256]

I understand what you mean but this site may not be the best forum to talk down to my Brothers on. I appreciate your insight sometimes but this may not be the best place for that.

Agreed!

Google

Great suggestion.