questions brothers ask and answer in public?

[pmvi]

Been tried, never denied, and willing to be tried again.... good morning all!

 

[Dontrell Stroman]

To prove your own ignorance and insecurity. If someone actually mandated it of me I'd laugh in their face. Prima facia demonstration they are a member of a clandestine lodge to make such a demand.

It's trivial to know if a man is a Brother without any of the buzzwords or documentation. Trade a few comments about events at lodge, though I have noticed Masons and Oddfellows can have each other rolling on the floor laughing by trading jokes about lodge events.

Im not disagreeing with you, I dont try brothers on the street, but if a man needed something that required me to completely go out of my way and he identified himself as a freemason I would want to know if he was a brother in good standing and of a recongized GL. Many ask what difference does it make, hes a man in need ?? My response to this is "I will go the extra mile for a brother mason" you may disagree and Im completly fine with that.

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[CLewey44]

Im not disagreeing with you, I dont try brothers on the street, but if a man needed something that was completely out of my way and he identified as a freemason, I would want to know if he was a brother in good standing and of a recongized GL. Many ask what difference does it make, hes a man in need ?? My response to this is "I will go the extra mile for a brother mason" you may disagree and Im completly fine with it.

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I feel you and agree with the last part for sure. If we can't do that then what was the point of some of those obligations we took.

 

[Warrior1256]

If someone actually mandated it of me I'd laugh in their face.

Same here.

Prima facia demonstration they are a member of a clandestine lodge to make such a demand.

Very possible.

Trade a few comments about events at lodge

This is exactly how I would react if someone identified himself as a Mason to me. I'd stick out my paw, introduce myself, and inform him of the lodges that I belong to and ask about his. However, there would be no "trial" or exchange of lawful Masonic information.

 

[Warrior1256]

Many ask what difference does it make, hes a man in need ?? My response to this is "I will go the extra mile for a brother mason" you may disagree and Im completly fine with it.

Absolutely!

I feel you and agree with the last part for sure. If we can't do that then what was the point of some of those obligations we took.

Agreed!

 

[Dontrell Stroman]

Same here.

Very possible.

This is exactly how I would react if someone identified himself as a Mason to me. I'd stick out my paw, introduce myself, and inform him of the lodges that I belong to and ask about his. However, there would be no "trial" or exchange of lawful Masonic information.

Thats where the confusion lies. Asking a few question concerning his affiliation and standings doesnt constitute a "Trial" for me. I think we are getting the "Examination" portion of how a visiting brother is done when trying to gain admission into a lodge confused with simple basic questions one mason can ask another. Granted, these questions can be learned online or from a duncan ritual but non the less these questions help you identity who is really a mason.

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[dfreybur]

Im not disagreeing with you, I dont try brothers on the street, but if a man needed something that required me to completely go out of my way and he identified himself as a freemason I would want to know if he was a brother in good standing and of a recongized GL. Many ask what difference does it make, hes a man in need ?? My response to this is "I will go the extra mile for a brother mason" you may disagree and Im completly fine with that.

That's a good distinction. If I give the sign of distress it's on me to show my dues card. If it's a social meeting, it's on me to laugh.

If there isn't time I'll fly to the relief and exchange dues cards later. First, let's work together to push that car off the railroad tracks before we hear a train coming. Whew, that done let's show each other our cards.

 

[Dontrell Stroman]

That's a good distinction. If I give the sign of distress it's on me to show my dues card. If it's a social meeting, it's on me to laugh.

If there isn't time I'll fly to the relief and exchange dues cards later. First, let's work together to push that car off the railroad tracks before we hear a train coming. Whew, that done let's show each other our cards.

Good point. Agreed. If I met you on the the street say you had on a ball cap and I approached wanting to be social about masonry (what lodge you hail from, and masonic events) I see no need to show dues cards as we are not talking masonic just about the masonic lodge lol. If you gave the GHSD for such an event where your car was stuck and a train was coming I would not ask for your dues card. Now say after I helped you move your car and you asked me to take you down the road three hours I would probably ask for a dues card because that is completely out of my way, but for a brother mason I found to be worthy I would.

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[frehm]

Just ask "Are you a Mason?"
Then you follow the secret ways of recognizing a brother with words and grip.

 

[David612]

Just ask "Are you a Mason?"
Then you follow the secret ways of recognizing a brother with words and grip.

I disagree, words and grips have no place outside of the temple, unless working with a brother to learn.

The point is that a random in the streets standing at lodge is irrelevant, you don’t know this person from Adam.
Should they be distressed and need your assistance I would help them in the same manner I would help anyone.
Additionally calling on brothers to produce dues cards may be and issue aswell, as far as I know it’s only the US that use due cards.

 

[hiram357]

I disagree, words and grips have no place outside of the temple, unless working with a brother to learn.

Really? What's the point then? Either the ritual has meaning or it doesn't. It's quite clearly stated that grips are for knowing a Brother in "darkness as well as light", which would imply, at least to me, that they can be used anytime, anywhere. Now, an argument can be made that they are perhaps inutile in these times when a cowan can easily find them in a book or on the internet, but to limit them to use inside the Lodge is an exercise in futility.

 

[David612]

Really? What's the point then? Either the ritual has meaning or it doesn't. It's quite clearly stated that grips are for knowing a Brother in "darkness as well as light", which would imply, at least to me, that they can be used anytime, anywhere. Now, an argument can be made that they are perhaps inutile in these times when a cowan can easily find them in a book or on the internet, but to limit them to use inside the Lodge is an exercise in futility.

I would argue it’s more important to protect the secrets you took an obligation to protect by not testing randoms in the street when their standing in a lodge, regular or not has no bearing on the interaction, being prudent on when one should put someone under the usual Masonic scrutiny is another way to guard our secrets.
Should this person want to visit your lodge then the time to test them is prior to being allowed through the west gate.

 

[Bloke]

I would argue it’s more important to protect the secrets you took an obligation to protect by not testing randoms in the street when their standing in a lodge, regular or not has no bearing on the interaction, being prudent on when one should put someone under the usual Masonic scrutiny is another way to guard our secrets.
Should this person want to visit your lodge then the time to test them is prior to being allowed through the west gate.

Which is outside lodge... just say'n

 

[David612]

Which is outside lodge... just say'n

You cheeky so n so, personally I was fortunate to learn in a convenient pub adjoining the lodge with knowing nods replacing some elements. realistically I couldn’t care if people want to test each other all day long if it is actually relevant to upholding our obligations but public testing of randoms for the sake of getting to use modes of recognition is silly.

would you not help this person if they wherent a mason?

 

[Brother JC]

“These generous principles are to extend further. Every human being has a claim upon your kind offices.”

 

[Dontrell Stroman]

Again, who said anything about testing a brother, which is the same as an examination. I clearly said ask a couple of questions. Not the full long drawn out process. I have to disagree with grips etc only being used in lodge. Maybe your jurisdiction teaches that but mine does not. In the case where a brother doesnt have a dues card then we will go from there. Point im making, "Freemasonry is about brothers taking care of brothers" im going out of my way to help a worthy brother verses a complete stranger.

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[Dontrell Stroman]

Just ask "Are you a Mason?"
Then you follow the secret ways of recognizing a brother with words and grip.

This question is fine if were just dicussing when our lodge meets and what appendent body we belong to. But If a man identifies as a freemason and is asking for help as a freemason he is getting asked more than just "Are you a freemason".

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[David612]

Making good men better, to other masons.

I think the teachings are supposed to extend to all people, not just your brothers.

 

[Dontrell Stroman]

Making good men better, to other masons.

I think the teachings are supposed to extend to all people, not just your brothers.

I agree and disagree. The teaching express and go into dept about taking care of your fellow brother mason. This is not to say we arent suppose to help others out, but I get so tired of masons speaking as if we are obligated to everyone as if they are the same as a brother mason. In my opinion there is a difference.

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[David612]

I agree and disagree. The teaching express and go into dept about taking care of your fellow brother mason. This is not to say we arent suppose to help others out, but I get so tired of masons speaking as if we are obligated to everyone as if they are the same as a brother mason. In my opinion there is a difference.

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Fair enough, I personally am cautious with charity as I have spent a lot of time on people who asked for help but wherent in a position to make use of it.
Now I extend my help to deserving people, Masons invariably are deserving as I know at a base level they are fundamentally good people even when we don’t see eye to eye,
That said should any other good person reasonably call on me for help I would treat them as a brother, be they man, woman or child.