US Navy

Discussion in 'Freemasons in the Military' started by mikecav, Apr 13, 2013.

  1. drw72

    drw72 Premium Member

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    The Navy has always prided itself on history and tradition (can't speak of the other services). The US Navy even follows traditions originating all the way back to the British Navy. Come to think of it, it is similar in a lot of ways to Freemasonry. Tradition, rituals, and hundreds of years of history.

    So when a few people in charge decide to get rid of 241 years of that tradition over night the sailors tend to get upset.


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  2. Companion Joe

    Companion Joe Premium Member

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    I've seen quite a bit of outrage from veterans. It is common practice to refer to someone as "Petty Officer so-and-so" anyway. But since man first took to the sea, your title has been tied to your job.
     
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  3. Brother JC

    Brother JC Vigilant Staff Member

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    I had a hard enough time with the phrase "Aircrew Survival Equipmentman." Yes, it was a more detailed description of my job, but dammit, PR stands for Parachute Rigger!
     
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  4. Companion Joe

    Companion Joe Premium Member

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    It really doesn't surprise me, though. From what I hear, boot camp is more like Girl Scout camp, and if someone says something to you, you get to hold up a little card that says they hurt your feelings.

    I served on a frigate. We had a saying: Iron Men, Tin Cans. I'm certain that is no longer the case.
     
  5. Ripcord22A

    Ripcord22A Site Benefactor

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    not like navy boot camps ever been that hard to begin with....lol

    Stress cards arent real. That rumor is in every branch. What is real is a card that has symptoms and ways to deal with stress.

    As for naval tradition what i cant believe is that there is still differnt mess halls for the different ranks. In the Army chow is served in reverse rank order and we all eat together. If a platoon sgt(e7) wants eat with his joes(e1-6) he can. The fact that there is so much seperation is crazy to me. And that officers are held in such high regard.....mind blowing to me.
    But maybe that because in the navy u need the cohesion that we need on the ground?
     
  6. Ripcord22A

    Ripcord22A Site Benefactor

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    Oh and as a recruiter when i talk to kids that say they are gonna join the navy and i ask why there are only 3 answers i get in this order 1) its easier, 2) i wont die, 3)family tradition/grew up on the water. Its never because they wanna kill terrorists or defend the nation or any of thenthings we hear about why they are joing the Army or USMC.
     
  7. Brother JC

    Brother JC Vigilant Staff Member

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    One of the reasons I joined the Navy was to get as far away from Roswell as possible.
    Easy? Join the Air Force. They get a ribbon for graduating from boot camp.
     
  8. Winter

    Winter Premium Member

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    Here we go. lol We need to rename the thread to bash each other's branch of service. :) Love ya all.
     
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  9. Companion Joe

    Companion Joe Premium Member

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    Oh, I'll grant you that if you are even remotely physically fit and definitely if you are athletic, Navy boot camp wasn't hard (at least in 1989). Navy boot camp is about teaching you to pay attention to detail, do your job without a second thought, and knowing the man next to you will be doing his. The simple act of getting a ship clear of the pier is a flurry of activity that requires hundreds of men doing hundreds of jobs with a choreography that would make a Super Bowl halftime show curl up into a fetal position and cry, and that doesn't even compare going to GQ or if you are in the middle of the ocean and a fire breaks out.

    I really am glad to hear the stress card thing isn't real. That at least gives me a little sigh of relief and hope for the future.

    I don't have a problem with the separation between ranks. Chiefs get a little separation not because they can't associate with the rest of the crew but because they've earned it. The chiefs are the backbone of the Navy. They've been around and know what's going on. There is a reason the chief's mess is called the "goat locker." It's a perk. I don't have a problem with the officers having their own space. The world isn't inclusive, and everyone isn't equal in terms of the job they do. I'm fine with that. The captain deserves the status he gets because the only two things more powerful than the captain on a ship at sea is the ocean itself and the GAOTU. The crew needs to fear and be in awe of the captain.

    I served as regular ole ET3 Nobody, and not once did a resent anything the guys in khaki had that I didn't. The tradeoff was that the sailors got to have a whole lot more fun in port when it came time for liberty call! We weren't expected to be officers and gentlemen. We were squids with pockets full of money who hadn't seen dry land in weeks, and it was understood that we'd have a great time.
     
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  10. Brother JC

    Brother JC Vigilant Staff Member

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    Indeed! Or launching an air wing from a football field sized runway in the middle of an ocean.
     
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  11. dfreybur

    dfreybur Premium Member

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    We were always PO3/2/1 to the folks in any other rating, so I get the point. Plenty of sailors had almost no idea which rating emblem went with which letters. In our shops we just wore our blue utilities that all had the same PO3/2/1 symbols anyways.

    Moving branches of the military to more similarity worked great for Canada. With the usual rumbling from the ranks while it happened and now years later they joke about the events. It'll work great for the US. With the usual rumbling from the ranks while it happens and years later they'll joke about the events.

    I'm not even going to learn the 3 digit number code that maps to Aviation storeKeeper.
     
  12. dfreybur

    dfreybur Premium Member

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    Piece of cake compared to getting them back onto the ship without smashing one into the bow! Naval Air Station - A runway that does not do evasive maneuvers while you're trying to land on it! Except in California during "shake and bake" earthquake summers ... Okay, that was just a 4 point 0, everybody carry on!
     
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  13. Winter

    Winter Premium Member

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    Interesting article popped up in my feed this morning about it.

    http://www.stripes.com/news/backlas...-rank-terms-roils-the-enlisted-ranks-1.432068

    Seems, to me,ike the major reason sailors don't like it is that it is removing what makes the Navy different from the other branches. Maybe it is time we look at why we have 5 branches of the military? We waste millions on different branches doing the same job.

    With one US military that has a ground componant, a water componant, and an air componant we could be more effective for less cost. One supply chain, one chain of command, an no more waste with every branch fighting for a share of the same pot of money to do the same job.

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  14. Ripcord22A

    Ripcord22A Site Benefactor

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    So the problem is that the Navy has all these different "Rates" to do what one person can do in the Army or MC. The Army had this problem within the Health Care field. We had Medics(68W), but there was also LPNs, Respiratory specialists, CNAs, Optometry specialists ect ect. All of these were their own Military Occupational Specialities(MOS) The Army has since done away with them as stand alone MOSs and they are now Additional Skill Identifiers(ASI) or Special Qualification Identifiers(SQIs) what this does is it allows a 68W to be placed in to a billet for a Respiratory Specialist and vice versa. If that 68W isn't certified for that position they will get it. All medics start out as a 68W1OO(68=job field; W=job title; 1=Skill level-1=e1-e4, 2=e5, 3=e6, 4=e7 ect; O=ASI; O=SQI) a medic that was an E5 LPN would be a 68W2M6. Even though they are a M6 they can still hold any E5 Billet in the medical field. They could be medic for a line unit, they could run a section in a hospital, they could be a shift leader at a troop medical clinic or be an LPN in a hospital unit. Its a good thing in the Army because it allows people to enlist as a Medic and progress from there, where the other branches might make them a optometry specialist and they just wanted to be a Medic....oh sorry Corpman er corpPerson?...lol
     
  15. dfreybur

    dfreybur Premium Member

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    Yeah, well tough. Growing up is hard but it's a part of life.

    You forgot the NOAA! Maybe even more branches.

    It worked for Canada to merge branches. OF COURSE the US can't imitate Canada, especially not on something that worked. Like no longer minting paper dollars and just going ahead and using the fact that vending machines already handle dollar coins. I mean like merging branches of their military.
     
  16. Winter

    Winter Premium Member

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    So model it on a military that consistantly wins. The IDF. One military with an army, navy and air force. All the same rank structure, supply chains, training. I just don't think the whole conscript thing would work here.

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  17. Companion Joe

    Companion Joe Premium Member

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    OK, so just keep the Department of the Navy and go strict isolationist. The Army and Air Force are pretty pointless. Thanks to our Navy, no viable ground threat could ever mobilize here. The Navy's aviation wing is about as big as the Air Force's, and it can deploy to more locations. The Navy has nuclear missiles. We've got the most elite special forces. If a ground campaign was necessary, the Marines will handle it and can do an amphib landing behind any would-be invaders.

    Equating the Navy not liking the change because it takes away what makes us special is no different than Freemasons not liking when people want to make us no different than the Rotary.
     
  18. Ripcord22A

    Ripcord22A Site Benefactor

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    Ummm...most elite Special Forces? SEALS are ok but SFOD-D(aka Delta Force) is far superior. Having worked with both......

    No viable ground threat? Look at all the sleeper cells already here.....i agree we could do away with the AF but we could also do away with the USMC. Fold the fixed wing air elements of both into the Navy, Rotary wing into the Army and all the ground elements in to the Army.
    I mean theres only 2 real branches of military neways....ARMY and NAVY, the AF is a corporation and the USMC is a Cult.
     
  19. Companion Joe

    Companion Joe Premium Member

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    My entire post was tongue-in-cheek because I don't agree with rolling branches into one another. They all have a specific role, and that includes the Coast Guard.

    By viable ground threat, I'm talking more on the lines of the Chinese. I don't care how big of an army they have, we'd send them all to the bottom of the Pacific before they crossed the International Date Line.
     
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  20. Winter

    Winter Premium Member

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