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Gay Men in Masonry

Should gay men be allowed to join Masonry?

  • Yes

    Votes: 34 82.9%
  • No

    Votes: 7 17.1%

  • Total voters
    41
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Ripcord22A

Site Benefactor
I think we're just arguing in circles here but the point is definitely subjective. .
Isnt that what all debates are?

My point is that what is an immoral lifestyle?.
Up to interpretation of the individual brother. In Christianity most just say that that person will be damned to hell lest they repent. In Muslim country's they stone or hang the "offenders" to death. Again up to interpretation.

a guy that's attracted to other dudes. I'd hate to vote out a good addition to my lodge due to his personal preferences.
And this is where it gets tricky. My son knows what "gay" is. My daughter has a friend who has 2 moms, she doesnt really understand it. Theres even a cartoon now that has 2 dads. But I dont want my kids seeing PDA. From straight or homosexual couples. So in my opinion if the man applying presented himself as a respected man and acted as a man and kept his personal life personal, i would have no issue. But m if that man tended to be more on the effeminate side and dressed as such and was always wanting to flaunt his sexuality then yeah id have a problem. Even if it was a straight man that was always seen displaying gross displays of PDA, id have a problem.

As i said before there is a gay man in my lodge now. i not only consider him my fraternal brother but also one of my great friends!


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CLewey44

Registered User
Isnt that what all debates are?


Up to interpretation of the individual brother. In Christianity most just say that that person will be damned to hell lest they repent. In Muslim country's they stone or hang the "offenders" to death. Again up to interpretation.


And this is where it gets tricky. My son knows what "gay" is. My daughter has a friend who has 2 moms, she doesnt really understand it. Theres even a cartoon now that has 2 dads. But I dont want my kids seeing PDA. From straight or homosexual couples. So in my opinion if the man applying presented himself as a respected man and acted as a man and kept his personal life personal, i would have no issue. But m if that man tended to be more on the effeminate side and dressed as such and was always wanting to flaunt his sexuality then yeah id have a problem. Even if it was a straight man that was always seen displaying gross displays of PDA, id have a problem.

As i said before there is a gay man in my lodge now. i not only consider him my fraternal brother but also one of my great friends!


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Fair enough. I wouldn't imagine that there are too many effeminate gay guys beating down the doors in the west trying to come hang out with a bunch of Masons. I don't think anyone would be comfortable with any person flaunting any sexuality if they walked in to petition a lodge and I don't think any gay man that would want to join would be that way. There are definitely standards. The guy I know, you' d "never know he was gay". He's a Marine. Hits the gym all the time etc. Drives a Jeep Wrangler if that paints a picture. PDA between any two can be a little off putting and to be honest, I've never seen two guys kiss or anything in person(other than tv) so I wouldn't say there's really an issue there no more than straight people doing so. I don't think there'll ever be a influx of effeminate or transgender or whatever guys trying to join.
 

RhushidaK

Registered User
Any thoughts on gay men being able to join Masonry? I know this topic has been hit on a lot but I work with a man that is gay and interested in Masonry. He's a Marine, upstanding guy but he is gay and has a partner. Would any of you object to allowing a gay man join? Would you be comfortable in that situation?

I have no problem with gay brethren. After all, their personal lives are not upto us to judge. What we do need to see is that they're good men, and as many brethren here pointed out, good to their family (which in their case would be their gay partner).

If we start judging and black-balling candidates as per our own personal religious preferences, we'd be doing Freemasonry a disservice as we'd be imposing our religious ideals on it.

Blackballing a gay candidate for being gay is like a Christian brother blackballing a Muslim candidate for not believing Jesus as son of God, or a Hindu brother blackballing a Christian candidate for eating beef, or so on. As Freemasons, while we are not forced to follow the beliefs of our brethren, we are at the same time required to respect and honour our brethren's beliefs, without imposing our own beliefs on them.
 

CLewey44

Registered User
I have no problem with gay brethren. After all, their personal lives are not upto us to judge. What we do need to see is that they're good men, and as many brethren here pointed out, good to their family (which in their case would be their gay partner).

If we start judging and black-balling candidates as per our own personal religious preferences, we'd be doing Freemasonry a disservice as we'd be imposing our religious ideals on it.

Blackballing a gay candidate for being gay is like a Christian brother blackballing a Muslim candidate for not believing Jesus as son of God, or a Hindu brother blackballing a Christian candidate for eating beef, or so on. As Freemasons, while we are not forced to follow the beliefs of our brethren, we are at the same time required to respect and honour our brethren's beliefs, without imposing our own beliefs on them.

Yes brother, that was exactly my point originally. You are spot on.
 

Bobby V

Registered User
Bigots view gay men as having an abnormal sexuality disorder. They then condemn this sexual disorder as characteristic of sexual predators. Gay or straight ... sexual predators should have no home in Masonry. As a Master Mason for over 42 years, I remember when petitions from men of color were as welcome as an ex's petition for an increase in alimony. Our great fraternity will weather this latest tempest.

"There is only one good, knowledge; and one evil, ignorance." Seneca

Fairport-Flower City 476 F&AM (GLNY)
Valley of Dallas, Orient of Texas
 
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Ripcord22A

Site Benefactor
Not sure who you mean (and it doesn't matter) but I remember the first openly gay candidate Cerrillos had... there was a bit of fuss and a good bit of discussion. When the dust settled we Initiated him. I don't think anyone has really thought about it since. As it should be.
We arent speaking of the same man. Im not sure who ur talking about but the one im speaking of is a transfer from another Grand Jurisdiction

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samelevel

Registered User
Not sure who you mean (and it doesn't matter) but I remember the first openly gay candidate Cerrillos had... there was a bit of fuss and a good bit of discussion. When the dust settled we Initiated him. I don't think anyone has really thought about it since. As it should be.

I'm wondering what happened to tolerance?


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Brother_Steve

Premium Member
If Masonry is going to subject itself to biblical law, then any man who has been divorced, had sexual relations outside of marriage, ...shall I go on ... should be just as guilty as the gay man in their eyes and should be unfit for Masonry. I wonder how many Masons that are anti-gay would go poof if would could wave that magic wand?

I guess you did hit on a point though. Some men are not comfortable with themselves based on the preferences of others.. Therefore, a gay man in lodge would just make them constantly think, "oh my god, does he want to have sex with me?!" every time that individual spoke with them.

The problem isn't with the Gay man. It's with those in power who cannot get over the fact that they have these uncontrollable emotional knee-jerk reactions when a gay man might walk up to them to have a friendly conversation. The argument that it is breaking some moral law is just something tangible for them to hide behind. Nothing more in my opinion.
 

CLewey44

Registered User
If Masonry is going to subject itself to biblical law, then any man who has been divorced, had sexual relations outside of marriage, ...shall I go on ... should be just as guilty as the gay man in their eyes and should be unfit for Masonry. I wonder how many Masons that are anti-gay would go poof if would could wave that magic wand?

I guess you did hit on a point though. Some men are not comfortable with themselves based on the preferences of others.. Therefore, a gay man in lodge would just make them constantly think, "oh my god, does he want to have sex with me?!" every time that individual spoke with them.

The problem isn't with the Gay man. It's with those in power who cannot get over the fact that they have these uncontrollable emotional knee-jerk reactions when a gay man might walk up to them to have a friendly conversation. The argument that it is breaking some moral law is just something tangible for them to hide behind. Nothing more in my opinion.

I would have to say, a lack of humility and thoughts of self-grandeur may be involved if you think every gay man (or woman too if that's one reason why they aren't allowed to join) that walks up to you wants to have sex lol.
 

Brother_Steve

Premium Member
I would have to say, a lack of humility and thoughts of self-grandeur may be involved if you think every gay man (or woman too if that's one reason why they aren't allowed to join) that walks up to you wants to have sex lol.
Homophobia is real. I am not homophobic, however those that are in a position to make sweeping decisions that affect thousands most likely ... are
 

zenotornado

Registered User
Why should it be a problem to be gay? In Germany it's no problem and if someone found his love I'm happy about it :)
 
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