Lodge Officer Duties - Junior Warden

Discussion in 'Officers of the Lodge' started by Blake Bowden, Nov 20, 2014.

  1. MBC

    MBC Twice Registered User Premium Member

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    We have quite a confusing system, and all three levels (Grand, Provincial, and Lodge) are separate.
    It is because you can have three ranks in the same time theoretically, but most brethren just use their highest level.

    For example in one of my lodges, a senior brother is a Past Junior Grand Deacon (PJGD) in the Grand Level, and Past Provincial Senior Grand Warden (PPrSGD), Past Master and Lodge Mentor in my lodge.
    In the Grand Level, He is more senior than one of our AProvGM for higher rank, but he is outranked by that APGM within the Province. He is more senior than the WM in both the Grand and Provincial Levels because Masters of Lodges are the lowest rank in the order of precedence but the WM is the highest rank within the lodge and he rule the lodge...
    such a confusing system...
     
  2. Brother JC

    Brother JC Vigilant Staff Member

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    That'll make Mark O. sad, he has a habit of being a grand-something in at least 3 organizations at a time.
     
  3. Ripcord22A

    Ripcord22A Site Benefactor

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    Well hes currently one of the personal reps for the SR. It only affects GL not any of the other grand bodies

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  4. Glen Cook

    Glen Cook G A Cook Site Benefactor

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    Your confusion is in the distinction between the power to govern (command) and rank. You find the same distinction in the military. The commanding officer commands all in his command, even if senior (it happened to me as CO). Past grand ranks have no power to govern by virtue of that rank. It just shows where we line up :).

    This is not unknown in the US. One may be a Grand Senior Deacon, but within the Lodge, the Master governs.
     
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  5. Ripcord22A

    Ripcord22A Site Benefactor

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    To me I wouldn't think the GSD is senior to a WM. The only 5 positions I can see being senior to a WM would be the DDGM, GJ/SWs, DGM, and GM. I under stand that they are GL officers but even in lodge a SD has no authority, so I wouldn't think that a GSD would have any in GL
     
  6. Bloke

    Bloke Premium Member

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    Perhaps they are senior, but here, when they enter an open lodge, even officially with an escort, even a mwgm salutes the sitting WM. I would say the WM rules supreme but suject to the Const. within his lodge, and the mwgm rules supreme everywhere else in freemasonry concerning his warranted lodges, again in accordance with our Constituion.
     
  7. Glen Cook

    Glen Cook G A Cook Site Benefactor

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    But, in many US jurisdictions, the GM or his deputized officer has the power to preside in a lodge
     
  8. Glen Cook

    Glen Cook G A Cook Site Benefactor

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    Again, being senior, and having authority, are two different issues. My experience is that grand lodge officers are considered senior, but do not have authority in the lodge. I see no reason a Gwarden would have greater authority in a lodge than a GDeacon.

    FYI, I was in Albuquerque with a bunch of your folk for Red Cross this weekend
     
  9. Ripcord22A

    Ripcord22A Site Benefactor

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    Oh man we had a masonic rendezvous(1st 4 lodges chartered in NM) BBQ. Woulda loved to have you. Glad you made it outta the city alive....lol

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  10. Glen Cook

    Glen Cook G A Cook Site Benefactor

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    I'm not supposed to say the barbecue would have been more fun.
     
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  11. Ripcord22A

    Ripcord22A Site Benefactor

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  12. dfreybur

    dfreybur Premium Member

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    That happens at Official Visit. The representative of the GM has the deputized authority to take over the lodge. Not that they ever do but it's possible.

    It is very common for a Grand Officer to be in attendance at a Stated meeting without it being an Official Visit. Brothers appointed to GL offices are active visitors and active in their own lodges.

    Should some GL officer show up and want to be in charge, I'd expect him to have a written letter from the GM authorizing him to do so. Otherwise he's just visiting. I've read of the GM showing up but I've never seen that happen. The only time I've ever heard of other GL officers having GM letters is back during the Haas situation several years ago.
     
  13. Keith C

    Keith C Registered User

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    Every time our DDGM attends a meeting at our lodge, Stated, Extra or an Official Visitation, the Warrant of Constitution and the WMs Gavel and Position are handed over to him. He then typically says a few (or sometimes more than a few words of greeting and then returns them to the WM.
     
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  14. SimonM

    SimonM Registered User

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    Is it just a formality or can he choose to keep it and lead the lodge for that evening?
     
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  15. Warrior1256

    Warrior1256 Site Benefactor

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    Same here.
    A bit of both here in Kentucky. This is done as a formality whenever a DDGM visits. However, the DDGM could take control of the lodge if he chose to do so.
     
  16. Keith C

    Keith C Registered User

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    Same here.
     
  17. Cootr68

    Cootr68 Registered User

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    Our lodge secretary is a DDGM I travel with him quite often on his official visits. Once he has been officially received and does his talking most WM give him the option to take over from there. Sometimes he does sometimes he doesn't. Never have asked him why or why not.
     
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  18. Warrior1256

    Warrior1256 Site Benefactor

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    Here when the DDGM is introduced he is given this option of taking over the lodge. I have never witnessed the DDGM actually doing this. He always respectfully declines.
     
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  19. Cootr68

    Cootr68 Registered User

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    I asked him tonight after degree work we were at. His answer was that he has been the lodge secretary for 27 years and wishes to go through the chairs again. All has been conferred before lodge opening whether he wants to sit as master for the remainder of the meeting. If the WM has been a PM a few times he will sit as master (DDGM). If it is a Wm first or 2nd time as WM he declines.
     
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  20. Brother_Steve

    Brother_Steve Premium Member

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    The WM in my jurisdiction can make, second and pass any motion he wishes within the bounds of our GL constitution and lodge by-laws. His authority is final. However, if he runs his lodge that way, he will be sitting in an empty lodge room.
     
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